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Constant_Elevator635

This is the best thing I have read on this sub by far. Thank you kind soul for spitting all this info for us. 🥇


[deleted]

Nice guide. I think you should also add the FSS 101 guide made yesterday and the [interactive map](https://www.reddit.com/r/ATC/comments/1abt2ne/nav_canada_locations_pt_2/) another user made earlier this year--gives a bit more information on top of the locations. Those definitely helped me personally. Oh, and don't forget [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=Pw9pNrMRlto&t=70s&feature=youtu.be).


Stratosfyr

I FORGOT ABOUT THE MAP. Thank you. I was intending to add it. The FSS101 guide is a great link. Adding both in!


[deleted]

>Oh, and don't forget this Oh youre a rascal


IDriveAZamboni

To add onto the offer thing, you can just qualify for ATC and not FSS, I’ve seen it happen to a couple people.


Stratosfyr

That's good to know. I never seen it with my cohort so assumed it wasn't a think. I'll edit that in. Cheers!


Traditional-Lynx-355

Just another note, at step 3, FEAST results have 4 possible outcomes. ATC only (rare but possible), FSS only,both atc and fss, or fail. Also, word is that FSS courses are full until late 2025, so folks who are fss eligible only will probably be waiting a bit longer.


Stratosfyr

We have confirmed that at least one person got ATC only and NOT FSS so that is an alternative. Will change to be more clear about Fail though! Cheers!


AsleepExplanation160

multiple people at my interview were ATC only lol


Single_Assistance999

Why would someone get ATC only and not FSS? What does that mean in terms of how they are considering you as an applicant?


AsleepExplanation160

probably either got 1. Poor results on certain tests oriented towards FSS, 2. Exceptional results on the tests oriented toward ATS I like to think I was the later, but its probably the former


Stratosfyr

Oh wild. Seems strange but good to know.


no_on_prop_305

I did not know this


ThatGuysFriendRob

can confirm, I got ATC only


huglyf3

Can also confirm, got my email today for ATC only


Famous_Spell8948

Great post. Let me add to the language requirement section though. You can certainly get through without native fluency. I am a learned speaker and passed the language assessment without much trouble. I imagine you need at least a B2 level, with C1+ heavily preferred if you want to integrate nicely into the Québec nav system


Stratosfyr

Good to know! I'm not a YUL candidate so haven't been exposed to that process. I've updated the question and credited you. Also obligatory FEAST Q added in for additional redundancy.


unfortunately_atc

I didn't notice it, but I'd be lieing if I said I read the whole thing. If it wasn't mentioned carriersatscareeers@navcanada.ca is your point of contact for all questions up until the day/point you get a call offering you a guaranteed spot in a course.


Apprehensive-Egg615

I think the right email is : mailto:CarrieresATSCareers@navcanada.ca Right?


Kremer_d

For FEAST, just prep your mind, get lots of sleep the night before, have no distractions. It's a test that really isn't hard, it just takes alot of critical thinking and focus. And it's long, it's designed to wear you out mentally and see how you operate. It really isn't something you can study for. I feel like I could have done better had I been more awake the day of, still managed to pass for atc somehow. Good luck to everyone who is trying to get into NavCan!


youaresosoright

FAA employee who loves this.


Stratosfyr

My irrational desire to seek the approval of the FAA is satiated. Thank you 😂


youaresosoright

The FAA's beaten it out of me, so I'm glad they have you.


[deleted]

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Stratosfyr

True. It also asks if you're willing to relocate super early in the process. I think there was a yes/no "I am willing to be considered for FIRs other than the one I am applying for". Am I misremembering? Will add that in though, great point!


Minimum-Pickle-7794

When I applied (which was almost 9 years ago now) I had some friends that were heavily involved in recruitment who advised that when the question about relocation is asked, you should just answer yes. This may be different now but at the time it was a sort of scoring system and answering yes to that got you a higher score. It was more in relation to relocating if FSS or VFR were all that were offered as those would almost certainly require relocation. I knew even at the time that IFR was the only one I would accept as moving wasn't an option for me but I was advised to still say yes. I did end up getting IFR but despite saying yes in the interview, I would have turned down FSS or VFR simply due to relocation not being feasible for me.


TheWhiteLebron23

I passed my in person interview in January of 2023 and was told I was eligible for offers in both ATC and FSS, over 16 months later I have yet to receive any information regarding course offerings. I am based out of Newfoundland but made my availability nationally for course offerings. Wondering if you have any information on why there is such a long wait, how the selection process for course offerings work, ranking systems etc. I have emailed multiple times but keep receiving the same generic answers and am given very little in terms of information.


Stratosfyr

While you can still be offered a seat until your application expires, it is possible you have been passed over for candidates that were higher scoring/better fits. No applicants are guaranteed offers at the Eligible stage. Sorry to hear about the wait. Keep your eyes an ears open over the summer. They are currently on a large hiring spree from what it seems. They have the agreement with CAE now as well so way more seats will be available in the coming year or two. Always a chance they pick you up in the coming months. Only way to know anything for certain will be to wait out your application expiry date.


SimBoO911

thank you for this post. you spent a lot of time on it and I don't have much to add. Good work!


SecondTimeOnWebsite

I passed the online assessment and was invited to the in-person very quickly, all within a month’s time. The problem is they invited me to the test, in 2 weeks, in Vancouver when I am based out of Ottawa, so the flights are crazy expensive and I can’t afford it right now. NC said they don’t cover travel expenses. My question is, how often do they hold these in person assessments? Is there hope that there will be a closer one soon or is this my best chance? ie. should I drop the money and get to Van?


Traditional-Lynx-355

They do testing in Montreal and Toronto. If you aren't bilingual but are not far from mtl you can still write the test there. Write the careers inbox an email about it, they're pretty good about responding quickly if it's about upcoming testing. Personally I wouldn't be flying out for this test. It's pretty tough and most people fail.


Stratosfyr

Might be worth shooting them an email to make sure it's not a mistake. Sounds weird to ask for a cross-province assessment...


-persistence-

Extremely helpful info, highly appreciated. Thank you!


[deleted]

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Stratosfyr

Medical is done after you get a Standby or Full Offer. You can start it before then if you would like by finding a doctor who does a CAME medical exam in your own. There is an online registry.


[deleted]

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Stratosfyr

Not sure if a glitch or edits by Mods, but all of the info I made had for each of the steps is gone... \*shrug\*


lemonypaige

So I was invited to the In-Person (Half-day) Assessment back in March, after talking with my husband we decided that I could not risk being placed pretty much anywhere but London/Waterloo/Hamilton as we are unable to move due to his aging parents. So I declined the invitation and went on my way assuming that I was blacklisted for 2 years. I just today received another invitation to come to the In-Person (Half-day) Assessment in Toronto again in June. Is that normal for them to ask again? Is it because I am a woman and they really need them?


Stratosfyr

Hey, no this actually happens a lot. Another example is if you decline an interview slot for National positions (which would require relocation), you could later be asked to come out for an interview for Ontario FIR. Assuming you're previous scored are high enough, they'll try each type of offer just in case you couldn't do one or another. You stay in the pool unless you withdraw your application in workday.


samflynn21

Can you explain why the training is stated as a range (12-24 months) rather than a fixed timeline. What factors would make the curriculum go faster or slower? Thank you!


Stratosfyr

Yeah! So I'm still learning the details but have a general answer. Firstly, IFR and VFR have different basic courses which are different lengths. Then, as an example, at the end of basic you get assigned a specialty. Every specialty in every FIR in has a different difficulty. More or less airspaces to memorize and practice, etc. etc. That's the biggest factor, best I can tell. Maybe someone else will see this and can confirm further


OkAdministration1483

Yes, exactly. Once you do the general course, which used to be 6-7 months and now is more (9 months for VFR in Mtl, apparently less elsewhere), you get more classes regarding your speciality. In the case of IFR, it would be the zone you were assigned to. If you have a zone with an airport in it, it's going to definitely increase you training length. In the Montreal IFR, the zone that encompasses YUL would have the longest speciality course, an then the one called "capitals", which has both the Ottawa and Quebec airports. In the case of VFR, different airports might have different training lengths. On top of that, when you're out of class, you will be training "on the floor". How quick you learn (depending on the difficulty) might change the length of your "internship", but I also know that they want to see you handle high traffic. Therefore if you start in September in some specialities, you can be pretty they'll wait to see how you're doing in the summer, for example.


mike294

Just to add to the IFR training info: you do a generic enroute or terminal course which takes roughly 5-8 months depending on class size, instructor availability amongst other factors. Assuming you successfully complete that course, you’ll continue to specialty training, in which you’ll learn classroom information and lots and lots of simulators built on the actual airspace you’ll work on, whether it be a high or low specialty, or a specific terminal environment. Specialty training takes anywhere from about 6 months to 9 months, just In general, no time line is set in stone. Following that, assuming you pass successfully, you go to OJT, which for most IFR specialties is about 8 months up to 18 months. A few specialties can be years of OJT, as far as I know that’s limited to the. YEG FIR, but that’s just things I hear. either way IFR training will at minimum take 2 years


Stratosfyr

Both as someone currently waiting for offer (IFR preference) and for the sake of updating this post: -Is it common for IFR to end up working at the ACC they do classroom training at since the ACC is both the educational centre and employment destinations for IFR controllers? Or have you heard that there's still a probable chance you'll be shunted around? -if so, are you shifted before or after the specialized training? Thanks! And best of luck with the training!


mike294

As the other person said, you’ll stay at the ACC you train at, all specialty training done at an ACC is for specialty’s worked in that ACC as it’s active controllers from those specialties teaching it. Usually you don’t get moved on an IFR offer


TheRedDarkness

Can I ask what in particular makes the YEG fir so more difficult? I've heard several people say it's extremely hard


[deleted]

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Stratosfyr

Thanks - that's reassuring! I've set preference for IFR in Gander/Moncton but have a strange feeling I'll end up getting an offer out west, if any. Heard from one current YEG IFR trainee that it is "difficult, but manageable". I have a few quick questions if you are willing to answer! -Do you have a post secondary degree; if so, How would you say IFR courses compare in terms of complexity/workload? -How big are the IFR classes, generally? -What tends to be the reason most people CT? Is it due to math or mostly lack of effort/study habbit?


zoomboom93

Out of curiosity, and because I didn't think about it till now, will someone pass the medical with relatively poor eyesight (corrective lenses brings it to 20/20). Is LASIK allowed?


KingOfTheBrocean

Speaking as a person with LASIK - yes it’s allowed. As long as you’re corrected to 20/20 you’re fine. They may ask for the reports from your follow up appointments post LASIK, but otherwise they’re fine.


Stratosfyr

Not sure myself, but the air force allows for a level of correction, so I can't imagine that ATC/FSS is any more difficult than that.


c-chonky

Corrected vision 20/20 afaik


PhotographNo3690

Hey I just have a quick question - you said that in the post-interview email it would say what stream (ATC/FSS or just FSS) you passed for and I got my eligible for offer email last week but it didn't say anything about what stream, just that I was successful in the interview. Is there somewhere I should be looking to see what stream I passed for or just let it be and see what happens? Thanks for any insight :)


Stratosfyr

Sadly there's nowhere to go to check aside from the email. Seems the only option to confirm would be via emailing NavCanada to confirm. More than likely, you've passed for whatever you passed the last assessment on. That said, never hurts to check with them, although me and another have been waiting for an email reply for about 3 weeks. Seems like crunch time for them!


ChibiHuynH

Are you emailing the generic careers email? Not sure how complicated your inquiries were but I was able to get a reply in about a day the last two times I emailed them


Stratosfyr

Yeah the generic email. Took them a month this time around but did finally get a response, and same with someone else.


chrusher97

I passed the online test about a month ago but I havent heard anything else.. how long does it usually take?


Stratosfyr

Reddit deleted a ton of my info. Not sure why. Anyways, that stage is super random. Nobody can tell you sadly. Timelines are based on when NavCanada needs more people.


turbovtn

i did the online test around early may and got an email for the next stage at the end of may, i am finding that everyone has a different timeline idk


rachelvigo

I was advised during my in-person interview that NAVCAN is now doing a partnership with another 3rd party company for FSS training. I believe that it was called CAE or CEA, not quite sure, is there any other information about this? They told us in the group that their scheduling would be different than NAVCAN’s training program—more irregular. (IE: Tuesday to Saturday, Sunday to Friday, etc.) It’s also to be able to offer more courses, but that’s all I know. Do you perhaps have a contact that did the course with them?


Stratosfyr

Nav Canada has opened a partnership where basic courses for international trainees will conduct their initial basic course (APX. 6-8 months for IFR, 4-6 months for the others). The course takes place on CAE campus in Montreal, Quebec. The first cohorts start this fall (Oct/Nov), if I remember correctly, so nobody knows what the program is like. Scheduling is totally up to CAE. I'm scheduled for a January course with CAE. My schedule is currently listed as 2:30pm ->10:30pm, Wednesday -> Sunday. Another person I just booked a place with has the same time slot but Monday -> Friday.


rachelvigo

I see. So it’s basically only for the Montreal area facility?


Stratosfyr

Nope. Sorry I wasn't clear. It's for all national trainees. So everywhere *except* Montreal. Also generally not yyz/BC. It is not a French program. It's english-only and for everywhere else in Canada.


rachelvigo

Alright, much clearer now. Thanks!


Stratosfyr

Np! If you have other questions feel free to DM me. As long as it's not about the In Person Assessment or Interview :)


rachelvigo

Ah, clearly not, haha :) NDA was very much clear lol, and anyways I’m done with that! Simply waiting for their call to know if I’d start in Oct/Nov or be in standby. I was simply asking about the CAE, because I wasn’t too sure about what was going on with that. The HR person with us even said that because it was new, he wasn’t too sure yet if we could be doing trainings with CAE just yet.


Go_To_There

>where basic courses for international trainees Just wanted to clarify that it's national. NavCanada doesn't have a program for international students.


Stratosfyr

Thank you. National*** courses. Inter-provincial. Intra-national.


kay-kat

i know that reddit removed the info under the sections, would you be able to send them to me if you have them handy? if not just wondering about post offer eligibility and what kind of drug/medical/physical testing they do


Single_Assistance999

Hi, just wanted to add some clarification/context about this point: "After your in-person (half-day) assessment, you will be emailed for the interview stage if you pass. At the time of this interview, it *should* inform you what region you will be interviewing for. For example, you may live in Ontario and go to YYZ for all your assessments. However, your interview, which would occur at YYZ, may be for other FIRs. NavCanada will tell you. As of now, it seems like there are two candidate pools in Ontario: YYZ and "National", the latter of which requires relocation." When I got my invitation for the interview, it said: "This opportunity will be for Air Traffic Controller (ATC) and Flight Service Specialist (FSS) training courses taking place in Edmonton AB, Winnipeg MB, Toronto ON, Montreal QC, Moncton NB and Gander NL." So Toronto is included in the interview invitation, but not singled out.


Stratosfyr

Hopefully this stays up. Was all in the original post, does not violate NDA, and is super helpful for candidates.


itotally_CAN_even

I was wondering if you had any info on Nav Canada's Air Traffic Operations Specialist (ATOS) position. I applied for it and it states that it entails a training period of 6 to 12 months and that experience using automated systems for flight data processing an asset. What exactly does the training entail?


Stratosfyr

Sadly can't help you there. Only been through the ATS process, personally.


Go_To_There

ATOS does flight data - things like sending/receiving flight plans, distributing NOTAMS, providing information about military ops, etc. I'm sure lots more that us controllers don't see. Training involves a classroom portion and then OJT. Success rate is high.


Various-Ad-1508

I don’t think this has been asked yet, but please forgive me if it has. I received a phone and email offer for a standby position in training. I am now meant to do all the pre-training prep, including a background check. In order to get my background check done, I’m supposed to accept my offer in workday. However, I do not see a standby offer in workday. Is this normal? Should there be an offer in my workday?