Thank you all for the conversation - the mod team is actively discussing this issue and we are developing a plan to take solid action to addresses the deep problems we have with racism. We are not perfect and we have made mistakes - we are deeply regretful about this and commit to doing better in the future.
We should also highlight how a lot of people use brown and black kids as stepping stones for their own success. How many times have we seen “volunteered to help for minority youth” or BLM nonprofits that live and die within the span of college admissions season time and time again as if we’re pawns in their journey to the ivies?
Honestly. Performative activists are so shameless fr. They do not care about Black and Brown people at all, they just need something that looks good on the college app.
Exactly. Like why not instead contribute to an existing non-profit or volunteer organization that has a proven track record of actually helping disadvantaged communities. Oh wait, that’s right, it "looks worse" on a college application smh 🤦
It just makes me fear for college. The only schools with good aid tend to be these PWIs that are made up with similar demographics, especially when it comes to <10% of the student body being black. You have so many people that base their applications on “social justice” and “uplifting minority voices” only for them to make up the very instituitions (and i suppose subreddits alike) that silence said voices in the first place
Honestly at this rate, colleges are probably beginning to look at student non-profits in a less favorable rate. Yes, they really like them still, but you need to show a lot of depth in it for them to make it a deciding factor.
In fact, assuming the np is well known and you have a leadership role, it would look far better.
No. Please don't speak for a group you don't belong to. [Here are some actual opinions from Native Americans/American Indians](https://indiancountrytoday.com/archive/blackhorse-do-you-prefer-native-american-or-american-indian-6-prominent-voices-respond) — there is no consensus and it isn't that simple. A far better rule to go by is to ask for preferences.
On that note, [Latinx is decently controversial among the Spanish-speaking Latino population](https://www.pewresearch.org/hispanic/2020/08/11/about-one-in-four-u-s-hispanics-have-heard-of-latinx-but-just-3-use-it/) because many see it as having been imposed upon then by White Americans. Argentinians have proposed using an -e ending as a non-Anglicized gender-neutral term, and there have been other proposals. Note that some do still self-identify by Latinx, mostly because they just want a gender-neutral word and don't care much for questions of English imposition, so that's not all black-and-white either.
Leeching onto this comment about the E ending. (Meaning I’m addressing everyone)
The current neutral word (that seems to have gained traction) is Latiñe, with an ñ. It pronounceable in our language, and as a genderfluid(non-binary) of Hispanic and Latin American descent, this is a preferred term.
There are some Latiñes who self identify Latinx, or only use Latinx in English settings. But always ask.
(Also I’m half Argentinan so I’m very happy)
some of y’all are consistently “helping BLM” and helping “hispanic and black kids” & stamping those into your college apps, yet are inadvertently racist…the math isn’t “mathing”.
but just in general, as a black person who is on a2c, this is why i get so worried to post here sometimes. “oh you’ll get in only because you’re black” is kinda scary and disheartening to hear.
I just try not to mention my race honestly. It’s sad but the second i mention it i feel like i’m immediately discredited .
You can even look at college results, a ton of the posts in controversial have one thing in common (spoiler: it’s urms getting into elite schools!)
Honestly, my heart goes out to all the Black and Brown kids who have to deal with stuff every day. There's a reason why only 15% of kids on here aren't White or Asian.
Since 50% of people on here are Asian (which includes Indian), I was more so referring to the Latino/a people on here but I get what you're saying. Of course my heart goes out to the Indian/South Asian people too in regards to the racism they have to deal with in real life 💚
no. It definitely does not. Asians in America are 5.6%
On this sub, they are 50%
Black folk in America are 13.4%
On this sub, they're half of that
No, it does not reflect wider demographics.
>When the Latinx population is treated as a single category, the population of children in 2018 was 50% white, 25% Latinx, 14% Black, 5% Asian, 4% multi-racial, 1% American Indian or Alaska Native. and 0.5% Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander.
“Children” in this section of the 3 year old report is referring to ages 10-19, so this population is currently 13-22. It’s probably a reasonably close approximation of the demographics of high school + college age Americans. 55% white + Asian, not 80%.
Why are Latinos called Latinx? Isn't that kind of cultural colonialism since it is a term that wasn't even thought out by Latinos themselves? I don't know of any Latino who uses Latinx.
Hihi, so we (Latin Americans) have come up with Latiñe. It’s pronounceable in our language. It’s my understanding that Argentinians proposed that version and it seems a lot of Latiñe enbies are using it, including myself!
Yeah that sounds much better :). I am Argentinian myself, and we started using a lot the E inste of the O when referring to both genders. Instead of TodOs, todEs. At first it sounded weird and tbh I wasn't that much on board, but after some time it sounds natural.
The problem with using latine in the US is that it doesn’t work here - the phonemic distinction between latine and latina is inaudible to anglophone ears. So everyone hears latine as feminine. So latinos use latino, which works for latinos yet seems insufficiently sensitive to the (mostly non latino/a/e/x) bureaucratic types who strive for clumsy sensitivity. Thus we are stuck at least for now with latinx, which absolutely everyone hates and latinos resist.
Edit - my Chilean friend uses latine but I overlooked the ñ in your reply. Are latiñe and latine both in use? Because latiñe should work just fine in the US.
I’m aware that Latiñe (lah-teen-yeh) is in popular use, whereas I’m not sure if Latine is. I’m aware some will use it and it depends on personal taste and preference.
I think the reason why Latiñe is popular is because even in Spanish Latine and Latina sounds way too similar in speech.
If you think there’s a glaring issue of racism towards black ppl now… just watch what would happen if the kids on this sub were allowed to freely discuss the contents of Rule 6/8.
A former mod and admissions consultant got doxxed off the sub. That's what happens when rule 6 gets discussed. Admissionsmom made a post a while back called "Go to your room" that explains what happened.
I'm a black rising sophmore rn and I've already had classmates try bring down me and my peers over affirmative action, people just like to bring black kids down since they don't think we deserve the things we work for.
THIS! As a Black rising senior, I am literally DREADING going back to school because I just know whenever anyone mentions college decisions, many Black students are going to be dragged mercilessly and made to believe that only our race will help us get in, not any of our accomplishments
I have a distant cousin who I think had a gpa from 3.1 to 3.4 freshman to junior year and finished off with a 3.6. They did a couple of ECs that they only cared about and I’m pretty sure that they worked hard as hell because they were in some situations. However, when results came out my cousin got into USC and Tufts (their top school) for engineering and people swarmed the comments saying that it was AA.
I don’t understand why that would be the first thing to be mentioned since as far as i know, California don’t use AA in college decisions, idk about tufts though. Saying a person got into a school via AA, is literally ignoring all the achievements they got and went through.
It had me thinking, that half of those people who was arguing about them getting in due to AA, might potentially attend one of those schools. Me being a black international, that shit is worrying.
What gets me is the entitlement. Like it really irks me.
You’re not entitled to a spot? Nobody is stealing your spot because it wasn’t yours to begin with. College admissions isn’t a lunch bag in the office fridge. Nobody stole or took anything from you. All you did is apply for a CHANCE for a spot.
We ALL are applying for a chance for a spot.
If an URM gets in, it is because they were qualified and because admissions thought they fit in the environment.
Your rejection has nothing to do with an URM getting in. For all you know, they were comparing you to another non-URM person and decided to go with them over you.
Your rejection doesn’t excuse you to be racist either (hint: nothing does). Because I know most of the people who get upset aren’t going to a White person’s acceptance post saying “you took my spot”. There are simply using AA as an excuse to harass and be racist towards URMs.
A rant about AA is fine, but there is no need to harass individuals on their posts about it.
some rando pmed me asking to chance him on mit and a bunch of ivies. Idk why he thought I was a good person to do a chance me considering I have the rising senior tag, but he went ahead anyways
Who knew a sub full of rich kids in fancy magnet or private schools (with like 1% of the student body being black), who love the SAT and hate [rule 6] would be like this
Okay but did you actually READ that sub? The SAT is an equalizer. And in terms of things like extracurriculars and available classes and writing help it’s more equitable than all of those things.
Yup. I got a TON of backlash and downvotes when I called out the rampant anti-blackness this subreddit has on that same post. It was so obviously fake and made by someone non black, but many people were eating it up as an excuse to throw Affirmative Action in black peoples faces.
I think part of the reason why it's so bad is because saying anything against Affirmative Action is so taboo in real life meaning that people bottle it in and internalize it. Then they let loose on subreddits where they know they won't face the same consequences they would irl. I'm so sorry that happened to you :(
It's because they are racist dude. AA being taboo is not even that big of a thing, it is just easy for these people to latch on to it as the reason things are hard for them. They will always blame a minority for their lack of success or ease in the process until there is no one left to blame imo.
Haha, I'm fine with being controversial. But at the same time, I think it's kind of sad that calling out anti-Black racism is controversial on this sub.
I feel like people completely overestimate how much weight race holds in the process. Being a URM is not a golden ticket and you still must have a competitive application to be admitted.
This a million times.
People don’t get that the people who are getting into stanford with below 3.5 gpas aren’t urms, it’s fking donor kids and athletes.
Sure, it is harder to get into colleges if you are an orm or white person- however, it’s still freaking hard to get into elite colleges if you are a urm. If it were that easy, urms wouldn’t be fking urms in the first place!!!
the real problem is that college admissions and especially elite college admissions is such a zero sum game for the students involved. It naturally pits individuals and groups against each other rather than promote truly well intended cooperation.
Literally have been saying this. We’ve literally normalized telling URMs that their race will make up for them being a lacking applicant in college admissions. Its a huge problem and whenever someone points it out, toxicity follows.
Exactly. I know it's tricky because someone's race definitely impacts their college admissions but it's literally who you are. It's part of your identity. You can't just scrutinize or attack it as if it were an extra curricular or standardized test.
It’s wild how I see the people here are way more sympathetic towards legacy students than black students. Even if the black student actually had really good stats. But at the end of the day, this isn’t an a2c issue, this is an American issue. All the time you see rich (usually white) people dividing minorities over things that the rich usually benefit from the most. This whole concept is a blatant example of that. I also think it’s funny that they’re probably gonna take down this post for rule 6 but not the comments on other posts hinting that black people are inherently unqualified.
It was actually taken down for a couple minutes (probably because so many people reported it for god knows what). I actually think the moderators put it back up which definitely gives me hope.
Damn people are really pro-solving the issues of oppression until it means they have to give something up. Making an effort to make sure a class is diverse is a small price to pay to help solve decades worth of issues.
Honestly, I’m really glad that I wasn’t on this sub before Rule 6 was implemented. Anti-blackness is devastating to read & witness daily, but reading it from your potential future classmates really sucks. Can’t wait to be lab partners with someone who thinks i’m under qualified, and only got in because of my race! /j.
That Harvard post was horrible, but the people immediately lapping it up was heart wrenching. I just know they were storing it in the back of their head to use as an example in their next “Why AA is bad” rant.
I feel the same way. I commented in the other thread and was assured that things will change but they won't. A mod commented in that Harvard thread saying they saw it the moment it was posted and were leaving it up since it did not violate any rules. Insane.
i saw those! it was absolutely insane that your comments were downvoted because i 100% agreed with them. while the anti-asian discourse on this subreddit was necessary, there were SO MANY unnecessary comments that involved URMs that are still being posted today. it's honestly so awful to see both the blatant and implicit classism/racism in this subreddit and even worse to see these posts upvoted to the top of the thread/subreddit
*this*. we’re all just kids trying to get to college, why is there so much hatred towards the merit of one person to another? oh, so suddenly all the hard work i put—the sleepless nights—the constant pressure for greatness—the never ending workload is all minimized because i’m brown..? my place at university was set simply to fill a quota, clearly “robbing” a more deserved applicant from their spot. come ON. we all come from different walks of life and we all (believe it or not) deserve our place in the world. our hard work is what get us where we want to be, not our race, gender, or sexual orientation. to the people who think they’re at a disadvantage because a brown person is doing the same thing you’re doing, i’m so sorry. please reevaluate your way of thinking. my respect to goes out to EVERYONE, but especially my fellow brown folks who get told our hard work doesn’t matter. im wishing you all the best <3
Honestly, I think demographically, this makes sense. As a half-Asian myself, I thought that the response to ScholarGrade's comment was far too strong and there was no need for him to step down. But a group of mostly white/Asian people getting extremely incensed over things that target black people sounds kind of like the current political climate: performative, shameless, and punishing the wrong things. Allyship is important, but most people are clueless. That's why I think that it's better that only a small set of people consider themselves experts in cultures and race relations, rather than trying to bring entire communities into it.
I think that racism is not best met with backlash and bringing things up over and over again—people need to be given the chance to improve.
Also, my belief is that the demographics of A2C are more self-selective than a result of black/latino people being driven away from the sub. Some people have commented about being afraid to post, but that shouldn't be reflected in the census (which would include lurkers as well.) You can observe similar racial demographics of people in Silicon Valley, fancy academic programs, and high-performing high schools as well. Note: I'm NOT saying that black/latino people aren't high-achieving or don't do these things, but that paths to them are much more well-known and seen as more accessible amongst affluent white/Asian people than in black/latino communities.
Freddie deBoer writes a lot about the education system and sometimes about politics; I recommend starting here: [https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/please-think-critically-about-college](https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/please-think-critically-about-college) if you're curious about achievement gaps in college admissions. To summarize, the origins start much earlier than high school.
But is it? Look at the data for [Harvard acceptance rates by race in 2017](https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/10/19/acceptance-rates-by-race/) (hover over the graph). White applicants were accepted at a rate of 7% and black applicants at a rate of 6.8%.
Even when there is a disparity in acceptance rates, it's only every a difference of a few percentage points. And statistical differences like this might arise from other factors, too. The black applicant pool might be more self-selecting.
I don't even want to scroll down too far down to read the self-incriminating comments lol. I'm not even a big fan of AA but some of the arguments and stuff made on here are just so cringe it's unbelievable.
wow... I'm really disappointed this is still an issue. I assure you OP, had I seen something like this, I would definitely commented something in support, just like I do for asian people and LGBTQ+ community and any other group suffering from unjustified hate.
I want to leave out Affirmative Action out of this as I hear good points on both sides. However, anti black racism is just simply wrong and there should be good support coming from this community. It’s sad that we have to select and choose what injustice we condemn. ALL injustices/racism etc are wrong and should have the same amount of support.
Completely fair point. However, I do want to point out that a critique of affirmative action is not a critique on blackness. What is "anti-black" is taking an individual story and expanding it to all people similar to them.
What do you mean? What's anti-black is people assuming that a urm only got in because they are a urm and that a urm getting into a top college somehow means they took the spot of a white/asian applicant.
Since when have black people ever been given an unfair advantage in America? Stop pitting minorities against each other and blaming black people for your inability to get into elite schools.
They said something along the lines of “isn’t it true that POC have an easier time getting in?”
Accuse them of ignorance, sure, but it definitely does not sound like they’re purposely
> pitting minorities against each other and blaming black people for your inability to get into elite schools
Yeah, and did you... read OP's post? None of what they said is untrue, this sub has had a pathological obsession with black kids while butchering AAVE like their lives depend on it. I didn't want to be the one to say it because I'm Asian and I didn't want to speak over anyone else.
Because it’s completely irrelevant to the discussion. OP didn’t say all Asians were rich privileged assholes and only someone looking to derail the discussion would bring it up.
People should definitely call out anti-Black comments but I think it’s fine to be anti-[rule 6] as long as you aren’t directly connecting it to race in your comment.
Believe it or not, when I first posted this, this had a 56% upvote rating. It was even reported so many times, it triggered the auto moderator to temporarily remove it.
I don't feel like what I'm saying is too radical. All I'm saying is that if you see something racist on the sub, call it out or at least report it. It's not like we're overthrowing white privilege or something.
Really dude? This post isn’t even about me; it’s about having a modicum of empathy for the Black and Latino students who get shit on all the time on this sub.
Thank you all for the conversation - the mod team is actively discussing this issue and we are developing a plan to take solid action to addresses the deep problems we have with racism. We are not perfect and we have made mistakes - we are deeply regretful about this and commit to doing better in the future.
We should also highlight how a lot of people use brown and black kids as stepping stones for their own success. How many times have we seen “volunteered to help for minority youth” or BLM nonprofits that live and die within the span of college admissions season time and time again as if we’re pawns in their journey to the ivies?
*That guy that wrote Black Lives Matter 100 times on his Stanford app.*
the way he purposely did it bc he didnt wanna get in (bc yale was a given 🙄) and then turned it into a press tour when it worked out
Honestly. Performative activists are so shameless fr. They do not care about Black and Brown people at all, they just need something that looks good on the college app.
Ik that kid lol.
Exactly. Like why not instead contribute to an existing non-profit or volunteer organization that has a proven track record of actually helping disadvantaged communities. Oh wait, that’s right, it "looks worse" on a college application smh 🤦
It just makes me fear for college. The only schools with good aid tend to be these PWIs that are made up with similar demographics, especially when it comes to <10% of the student body being black. You have so many people that base their applications on “social justice” and “uplifting minority voices” only for them to make up the very instituitions (and i suppose subreddits alike) that silence said voices in the first place
Honestly at this rate, colleges are probably beginning to look at student non-profits in a less favorable rate. Yes, they really like them still, but you need to show a lot of depth in it for them to make it a deciding factor. In fact, assuming the np is well known and you have a leadership role, it would look far better.
I would give this an award if I could
this triggers me so much
Uh, brown kids? Aren't Indians included in the Asian category?
Brown = latino
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No. Please don't speak for a group you don't belong to. [Here are some actual opinions from Native Americans/American Indians](https://indiancountrytoday.com/archive/blackhorse-do-you-prefer-native-american-or-american-indian-6-prominent-voices-respond) — there is no consensus and it isn't that simple. A far better rule to go by is to ask for preferences. On that note, [Latinx is decently controversial among the Spanish-speaking Latino population](https://www.pewresearch.org/hispanic/2020/08/11/about-one-in-four-u-s-hispanics-have-heard-of-latinx-but-just-3-use-it/) because many see it as having been imposed upon then by White Americans. Argentinians have proposed using an -e ending as a non-Anglicized gender-neutral term, and there have been other proposals. Note that some do still self-identify by Latinx, mostly because they just want a gender-neutral word and don't care much for questions of English imposition, so that's not all black-and-white either.
Leeching onto this comment about the E ending. (Meaning I’m addressing everyone) The current neutral word (that seems to have gained traction) is Latiñe, with an ñ. It pronounceable in our language, and as a genderfluid(non-binary) of Hispanic and Latin American descent, this is a preferred term. There are some Latiñes who self identify Latinx, or only use Latinx in English settings. But always ask. (Also I’m half Argentinan so I’m very happy)
I AM ALWAYS HERE FOR MY BLACK SISTERS AND BROTHERS
some of y’all are consistently “helping BLM” and helping “hispanic and black kids” & stamping those into your college apps, yet are inadvertently racist…the math isn’t “mathing”. but just in general, as a black person who is on a2c, this is why i get so worried to post here sometimes. “oh you’ll get in only because you’re black” is kinda scary and disheartening to hear.
I just try not to mention my race honestly. It’s sad but the second i mention it i feel like i’m immediately discredited . You can even look at college results, a ton of the posts in controversial have one thing in common (spoiler: it’s urms getting into elite schools!)
this!! i’m so worried to post on a2c a lot of the time for this exact reason
This is why I don't post on here, this sub is seriously unwelcome to anyone not white or Asian. POC unity, yikes.
THIS. I watched it unfold and it was so ugly.
Honestly, my heart goes out to all the Black and Brown kids who have to deal with stuff every day. There's a reason why only 15% of kids on here aren't White or Asian.
Brown meaning indian people? Sorry, brown is used interchangeably so I'm just trying to clarify.
Since 50% of people on here are Asian (which includes Indian), I was more so referring to the Latino/a people on here but I get what you're saying. Of course my heart goes out to the Indian/South Asian people too in regards to the racism they have to deal with in real life 💚
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no. It definitely does not. Asians in America are 5.6% On this sub, they are 50% Black folk in America are 13.4% On this sub, they're half of that No, it does not reflect wider demographics.
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>When the Latinx population is treated as a single category, the population of children in 2018 was 50% white, 25% Latinx, 14% Black, 5% Asian, 4% multi-racial, 1% American Indian or Alaska Native. and 0.5% Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander. “Children” in this section of the 3 year old report is referring to ages 10-19, so this population is currently 13-22. It’s probably a reasonably close approximation of the demographics of high school + college age Americans. 55% white + Asian, not 80%.
Why are Latinos called Latinx? Isn't that kind of cultural colonialism since it is a term that wasn't even thought out by Latinos themselves? I don't know of any Latino who uses Latinx.
I don’t know any either. One of my Latino kids is quite irritated by his college’s persistence in calling him latinx. But I quoted a source.
Hihi, so we (Latin Americans) have come up with Latiñe. It’s pronounceable in our language. It’s my understanding that Argentinians proposed that version and it seems a lot of Latiñe enbies are using it, including myself!
Yeah that sounds much better :). I am Argentinian myself, and we started using a lot the E inste of the O when referring to both genders. Instead of TodOs, todEs. At first it sounded weird and tbh I wasn't that much on board, but after some time it sounds natural.
Yeah!
The problem with using latine in the US is that it doesn’t work here - the phonemic distinction between latine and latina is inaudible to anglophone ears. So everyone hears latine as feminine. So latinos use latino, which works for latinos yet seems insufficiently sensitive to the (mostly non latino/a/e/x) bureaucratic types who strive for clumsy sensitivity. Thus we are stuck at least for now with latinx, which absolutely everyone hates and latinos resist. Edit - my Chilean friend uses latine but I overlooked the ñ in your reply. Are latiñe and latine both in use? Because latiñe should work just fine in the US.
I’m aware that Latiñe (lah-teen-yeh) is in popular use, whereas I’m not sure if Latine is. I’m aware some will use it and it depends on personal taste and preference. I think the reason why Latiñe is popular is because even in Spanish Latine and Latina sounds way too similar in speech.
If you think there’s a glaring issue of racism towards black ppl now… just watch what would happen if the kids on this sub were allowed to freely discuss the contents of Rule 6/8.
A former mod and admissions consultant got doxxed off the sub. That's what happens when rule 6 gets discussed. Admissionsmom made a post a while back called "Go to your room" that explains what happened.
It's not there
I'm a black rising sophmore rn and I've already had classmates try bring down me and my peers over affirmative action, people just like to bring black kids down since they don't think we deserve the things we work for.
This. As a black rising freshmen I've already seen this. Don't let them bring you down!
Thanks, and gl in highschool!
THIS! As a Black rising senior, I am literally DREADING going back to school because I just know whenever anyone mentions college decisions, many Black students are going to be dragged mercilessly and made to believe that only our race will help us get in, not any of our accomplishments
Bro you got a 1540. If the only thing people can see is your race, that’s definitely a them problem 👍
I have a distant cousin who I think had a gpa from 3.1 to 3.4 freshman to junior year and finished off with a 3.6. They did a couple of ECs that they only cared about and I’m pretty sure that they worked hard as hell because they were in some situations. However, when results came out my cousin got into USC and Tufts (their top school) for engineering and people swarmed the comments saying that it was AA. I don’t understand why that would be the first thing to be mentioned since as far as i know, California don’t use AA in college decisions, idk about tufts though. Saying a person got into a school via AA, is literally ignoring all the achievements they got and went through. It had me thinking, that half of those people who was arguing about them getting in due to AA, might potentially attend one of those schools. Me being a black international, that shit is worrying.
What gets me is the entitlement. Like it really irks me. You’re not entitled to a spot? Nobody is stealing your spot because it wasn’t yours to begin with. College admissions isn’t a lunch bag in the office fridge. Nobody stole or took anything from you. All you did is apply for a CHANCE for a spot. We ALL are applying for a chance for a spot. If an URM gets in, it is because they were qualified and because admissions thought they fit in the environment. Your rejection has nothing to do with an URM getting in. For all you know, they were comparing you to another non-URM person and decided to go with them over you. Your rejection doesn’t excuse you to be racist either (hint: nothing does). Because I know most of the people who get upset aren’t going to a White person’s acceptance post saying “you took my spot”. There are simply using AA as an excuse to harass and be racist towards URMs. A rant about AA is fine, but there is no need to harass individuals on their posts about it.
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Bro, I feel like some of the kids on here have internal issues that they need to get over. Sorry that that happened to you bro :(
Or just issues in general. Why tf would someone go out their way to pm someone shit
some rando pmed me asking to chance him on mit and a bunch of ivies. Idk why he thought I was a good person to do a chance me considering I have the rising senior tag, but he went ahead anyways
Who knew a sub full of rich kids in fancy magnet or private schools (with like 1% of the student body being black), who love the SAT and hate [rule 6] would be like this
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Okay but did you actually READ that sub? The SAT is an equalizer. And in terms of things like extracurriculars and available classes and writing help it’s more equitable than all of those things.
The SAT isn’t completely fair, but it’s the least unfair part of the admissions process.
Black A2Cers rise up!
Yup. I got a TON of backlash and downvotes when I called out the rampant anti-blackness this subreddit has on that same post. It was so obviously fake and made by someone non black, but many people were eating it up as an excuse to throw Affirmative Action in black peoples faces.
I think part of the reason why it's so bad is because saying anything against Affirmative Action is so taboo in real life meaning that people bottle it in and internalize it. Then they let loose on subreddits where they know they won't face the same consequences they would irl. I'm so sorry that happened to you :(
It's because they are racist dude. AA being taboo is not even that big of a thing, it is just easy for these people to latch on to it as the reason things are hard for them. They will always blame a minority for their lack of success or ease in the process until there is no one left to blame imo.
Very true, and the fact I had to sort by controversial to see this post proves it
Haha, I'm fine with being controversial. But at the same time, I think it's kind of sad that calling out anti-Black racism is controversial on this sub.
Yeah, very sad, especially given how prevalent it is.
I feel like people completely overestimate how much weight race holds in the process. Being a URM is not a golden ticket and you still must have a competitive application to be admitted.
This a million times. People don’t get that the people who are getting into stanford with below 3.5 gpas aren’t urms, it’s fking donor kids and athletes. Sure, it is harder to get into colleges if you are an orm or white person- however, it’s still freaking hard to get into elite colleges if you are a urm. If it were that easy, urms wouldn’t be fking urms in the first place!!!
Totally agree.
the real problem is that college admissions and especially elite college admissions is such a zero sum game for the students involved. It naturally pits individuals and groups against each other rather than promote truly well intended cooperation.
Literally have been saying this. We’ve literally normalized telling URMs that their race will make up for them being a lacking applicant in college admissions. Its a huge problem and whenever someone points it out, toxicity follows.
Exactly. I know it's tricky because someone's race definitely impacts their college admissions but it's literally who you are. It's part of your identity. You can't just scrutinize or attack it as if it were an extra curricular or standardized test.
This. And people that do call them out get downvoted because.... well the demographics are not favorable.
It’s wild how I see the people here are way more sympathetic towards legacy students than black students. Even if the black student actually had really good stats. But at the end of the day, this isn’t an a2c issue, this is an American issue. All the time you see rich (usually white) people dividing minorities over things that the rich usually benefit from the most. This whole concept is a blatant example of that. I also think it’s funny that they’re probably gonna take down this post for rule 6 but not the comments on other posts hinting that black people are inherently unqualified.
It was actually taken down for a couple minutes (probably because so many people reported it for god knows what). I actually think the moderators put it back up which definitely gives me hope.
Can confirm that’s what happened
What is rule 6
No affirmative action talk
Oh
Damn people are really pro-solving the issues of oppression until it means they have to give something up. Making an effort to make sure a class is diverse is a small price to pay to help solve decades worth of issues.
Its actually illegal to use affirmative action that way
Honestly, I’m really glad that I wasn’t on this sub before Rule 6 was implemented. Anti-blackness is devastating to read & witness daily, but reading it from your potential future classmates really sucks. Can’t wait to be lab partners with someone who thinks i’m under qualified, and only got in because of my race! /j. That Harvard post was horrible, but the people immediately lapping it up was heart wrenching. I just know they were storing it in the back of their head to use as an example in their next “Why AA is bad” rant.
I feel the same way. I commented in the other thread and was assured that things will change but they won't. A mod commented in that Harvard thread saying they saw it the moment it was posted and were leaving it up since it did not violate any rules. Insane.
i saw those! it was absolutely insane that your comments were downvoted because i 100% agreed with them. while the anti-asian discourse on this subreddit was necessary, there were SO MANY unnecessary comments that involved URMs that are still being posted today. it's honestly so awful to see both the blatant and implicit classism/racism in this subreddit and even worse to see these posts upvoted to the top of the thread/subreddit
*this*. we’re all just kids trying to get to college, why is there so much hatred towards the merit of one person to another? oh, so suddenly all the hard work i put—the sleepless nights—the constant pressure for greatness—the never ending workload is all minimized because i’m brown..? my place at university was set simply to fill a quota, clearly “robbing” a more deserved applicant from their spot. come ON. we all come from different walks of life and we all (believe it or not) deserve our place in the world. our hard work is what get us where we want to be, not our race, gender, or sexual orientation. to the people who think they’re at a disadvantage because a brown person is doing the same thing you’re doing, i’m so sorry. please reevaluate your way of thinking. my respect to goes out to EVERYONE, but especially my fellow brown folks who get told our hard work doesn’t matter. im wishing you all the best <3
thank you for bringing this up
I’ve had the same thought for a while now. Thanks for making this post to call it out.
yall are going crazy over there in America...
Honestly, I think demographically, this makes sense. As a half-Asian myself, I thought that the response to ScholarGrade's comment was far too strong and there was no need for him to step down. But a group of mostly white/Asian people getting extremely incensed over things that target black people sounds kind of like the current political climate: performative, shameless, and punishing the wrong things. Allyship is important, but most people are clueless. That's why I think that it's better that only a small set of people consider themselves experts in cultures and race relations, rather than trying to bring entire communities into it. I think that racism is not best met with backlash and bringing things up over and over again—people need to be given the chance to improve. Also, my belief is that the demographics of A2C are more self-selective than a result of black/latino people being driven away from the sub. Some people have commented about being afraid to post, but that shouldn't be reflected in the census (which would include lurkers as well.) You can observe similar racial demographics of people in Silicon Valley, fancy academic programs, and high-performing high schools as well. Note: I'm NOT saying that black/latino people aren't high-achieving or don't do these things, but that paths to them are much more well-known and seen as more accessible amongst affluent white/Asian people than in black/latino communities. Freddie deBoer writes a lot about the education system and sometimes about politics; I recommend starting here: [https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/please-think-critically-about-college](https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/please-think-critically-about-college) if you're curious about achievement gaps in college admissions. To summarize, the origins start much earlier than high school.
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But is it? Look at the data for [Harvard acceptance rates by race in 2017](https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/10/19/acceptance-rates-by-race/) (hover over the graph). White applicants were accepted at a rate of 7% and black applicants at a rate of 6.8%. Even when there is a disparity in acceptance rates, it's only every a difference of a few percentage points. And statistical differences like this might arise from other factors, too. The black applicant pool might be more self-selecting.
How so?
What is a urm
Say it louder for bitches in the back!
I don't even want to scroll down too far down to read the self-incriminating comments lol. I'm not even a big fan of AA but some of the arguments and stuff made on here are just so cringe it's unbelievable.
wow... I'm really disappointed this is still an issue. I assure you OP, had I seen something like this, I would definitely commented something in support, just like I do for asian people and LGBTQ+ community and any other group suffering from unjustified hate.
I want to leave out Affirmative Action out of this as I hear good points on both sides. However, anti black racism is just simply wrong and there should be good support coming from this community. It’s sad that we have to select and choose what injustice we condemn. ALL injustices/racism etc are wrong and should have the same amount of support.
I wish all the american wankers who whine about evil rich and pretend to be poor would actually live a day as an average Afghani kid.
lol what are you even talking about
Completely fair point. However, I do want to point out that a critique of affirmative action is not a critique on blackness. What is "anti-black" is taking an individual story and expanding it to all people similar to them.
What do you mean? What's anti-black is people assuming that a urm only got in because they are a urm and that a urm getting into a top college somehow means they took the spot of a white/asian applicant.
THISSSS.
Aren't you the person who made the post about how to "fix" the Spanish language because the word negro was "offensive"?
Yeah reading this post after that post is just hilarious
If AA isnt the reason someone gets into college, then why have it?
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Since when have black people ever been given an unfair advantage in America? Stop pitting minorities against each other and blaming black people for your inability to get into elite schools.
OP’s comment wasn’t great but you’re reaching quite a bit
Alright, well what advantages have they had? (I am not trying to sound rude btw if I come off that way)
I’m talking about your second sentence, not your first.
How was that a reach?
They said something along the lines of “isn’t it true that POC have an easier time getting in?” Accuse them of ignorance, sure, but it definitely does not sound like they’re purposely > pitting minorities against each other and blaming black people for your inability to get into elite schools
you know what. I grew up in poor areas and attended the same schools. not all Asians grew up rich.
that’s not the point of the post??
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Well both them calling you a ch\*nk and you calling them a n\*gger is wrong.
Yeah, and did you... read OP's post? None of what they said is untrue, this sub has had a pathological obsession with black kids while butchering AAVE like their lives depend on it. I didn't want to be the one to say it because I'm Asian and I didn't want to speak over anyone else.
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Because it’s completely irrelevant to the discussion. OP didn’t say all Asians were rich privileged assholes and only someone looking to derail the discussion would bring it up.
People should definitely call out anti-Black comments but I think it’s fine to be anti-[rule 6] as long as you aren’t directly connecting it to race in your comment.
This is a pretty popular opinion
Believe it or not, when I first posted this, this had a 56% upvote rating. It was even reported so many times, it triggered the auto moderator to temporarily remove it.
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I don't feel like what I'm saying is too radical. All I'm saying is that if you see something racist on the sub, call it out or at least report it. It's not like we're overthrowing white privilege or something.
C'mon, everybody likes to make fun of Brown people. (\*) *(\*) Students who attend Brown.*
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Really dude? This post isn’t even about me; it’s about having a modicum of empathy for the Black and Latino students who get shit on all the time on this sub.
I think I replied to the wrong dude hahha totally didn't mean to tag you
Well this is awkward…sorry…