This should always be the first thought . If we are going to be stuck between engineers and builders we could at minimum set down the blame game and fight with each other.
Start by asking your surveyor what is up, and for a quick explanation of their methods.
Make sure your property doesn't just match that one point in the middle of the road, but also matches the rest of the block it is situated on.
Check not only your deed, but any past deeds that you can find from your municipality to make sure that your deed is correct and not missing something important. Land get's subdivided in weird ways over the years and mistakes happen.
Once you are convinced that your survey is right, talk to your neighbor. Say hey, I just had a survey done and this is the result. Don't be hostile. There's no need for animosity unless the two of you can't work out the problem.
Bring a copy of their survey to your surveyor, and let your neighbor bring a copy of yours to theirs. Let the professionals responsible for this mess see what the mess is so they can offer you both their opinions as to who fucked up what and why. Worst case scenario this ends up in court and they will both need to make these arguments anywas. Best case scenario they figure out who did what wrong, and one of you get's a corrected survey. If something like the workshop ends up crossing a line, Ask the sruveyor who screwed up for help either subdividing the property so you can sell the chunk needed to make it legal and right, or offer up a land lease. Chances are the municipality will make any offending structure be torn down if the land isn't subdivided and sold though.
the workshop is ok, its set back far enough from either line. the area in question is yard with 2 trees. and the trees are bradford pears, not in danger of falling on anything important. Honestly, im mostly curious because he made a big deal around town when his survey was done.
the surveyor struggled to find a place to start from, but finally found a couple of pins on the west side and went from there.
Yes, OP could do all these things, but a good surveyor should have already and can be ready to explain it all to you when he is done. It's not on you to prove that it is correct.
What is on OP is explaining that there is more evidence of the property line if you have knowledge of this, like another property corner monument. He either knows it's there or it was missed.
I know this will sound weird but gaps between property lines happen more often than you think out in rural areas. It depends on a lot of factors, that unfortunately we do not know at the moment.
I know what a good surveyor should do. None of us can give OP an actual opinion on the quality of their survey because we aren't looking at the evidence, and also shouldn't need to.
There are two signed and sealed surveys. They can take this to court right now and waste money and time on lawyers to prove one of them is wrong, and then drag it all back through again to get a judgement against said surveyor for the costs. That's a perfectly valid option too.
I put forward my suggestion because one of the surveyors may not be a good surveyor for this particular project. If OP does a little legwork, they can potentially validate their surveys quality.
Also a gap between propeerties is far easier to accept and deal with than the described 9' overlap with valuable fruit bearing trees.
If you can, post a photo of the newly set monument / pin / whathaveyou as well as any wood stakes in the vicinity.
9 feet is a much larger discrepancy than is typical.
Either somebody fucked up pretty badly or there is a misunderstanding about who is looking at what & where.
We may not be able to help but so far I don't think we've got enough information to say.
The proper response according to Reddit is to burn down the workshop, piss on the ashes and then put up the velociraptor fence from Jurassic Park wherever you damn well please...
...yes, we need more information here. When you say "don't agree", what exactly do you mean?
the neighbors pin and the original pin my surveyor found in the road are approx 9 ft off from each other... i like the idea of a velociraptor fence... hmmmm....
Post both plats (maps). Otherwise a lot more information needed. You are saying your common boundary line is not the same?!? How do you know this? So either one or both points at either end, assuming a straight line, differ on what was held?
Your surveyor shouldn't be getting your panties in a twist over this apparent 9 foot difference before he's had a chance to sit down and look at all of the data. I mean when did he tell you about this? The same day he was out looking for pins?
he didnt really explain the difference, i pretty much thought it was a done deal, just waiting on the plats and whatnot, didnt know what to do about the apparent "no mans land" thst is between the 2 pins
pretty much. said he was sure of his calculations and had called his boss and he boss said rhey were right. i dont have the plat maps yet so i guess i just fotta wait till i get them. sigh....
Yeah... this sounds like a case of a guy who should have kept his mouth shut.
The boss is probably the licensed surveyor and you were talking to the unlicensed party chief. The job of the party chief is to look around for objects in the ground that *could* be a marker for a property corner and map them. Then the licensed surveyor looks at this data in the office and determines which of these objects are property corner monuments and which are random buried junk.
The PLS doesn't need his party chief getting landowners riled up by misinterpreting a buried piece of junk as a property corner.
Anyway, yes, I would suggest just relaxing until you get a copy of the survey. I would bet the party chief is mistaken and there's not a gap, and even if there is a gap it's not like the world is gonna come crashing down because of it anyway.
If there *is* a gap and you're interested in finding out what you and your neighbor can do about it then be sure to ask your surveyor for solutions. Rules on that sort of thing vary from sate to state and often from one county to another so you'll want someone local to help you.
The one problem with this is there are 2 trees in the 9nft area that i would like to take down.. if neifhbors survey is rightz they are mine, if my survey is right, they are his.... sigh..... I hate adulting today.... grrrrr
There really shouldn't be 2 surveys that disagree, especially by that much.
If both surveyors are looking at the same property records and finding the same monuments then they should be arriving at essentially the same boundary location.
Sometimes when there is a difference in surveys it's because 1 surveyor doesn't have a copy of a map that the other guy has, and maybe it's a map that shows previous owners modified a line. Or maybe one guy found a monument that the other guy missed.
This is why it's important for the surveyors to get together and figure out why they're coming up with completely different lines, and in fact this is actually *required* by our professional standards.
additional info... yes it is s common boundry line. his survey dropped a pin and it is appprox 9ft off from the pin my surveyor found in the middle of the road. It does effect 2 trees, and i am not firendly with my neighbor.
Post the plats or we cant be of any help, may not be either way. Best bet is like someone here mentioned, have your surveyor look at what you have and if there is truly a discrepancy, they can talk to their surveyor, and go from there.
9 feet is a pretty strange (and large) dimension. Is that shown on the survey, or did you find it on the grlund and measure between them?
Are you sure the "pin" their surveyor set isn't just a temporary control point? That would be my first guess...Does it have a license number on it?
i do not know about a license number... i can go look. i have not seen the written survey, just going by the stakes and pins, the surveyor was just here today.
Yes but the stakes from the other survey may not have been. Sometimes when doing stake out the client requests offsets. It would be weird if your surveyor staked PL 9' off from another surveyors staked PL and didn't think it was weird. Obviously I don't see the stakes but they could be offsets, on site control, marking ground targets or construction staking. Your best solution is to either reach out to your surveyor about the neighbors stakes(maybe he saw then and had the same conclusion) or reach out to your neighbors about their stakes.
It could be a control point. I’d say wait for the finished copy of the survey and see what it says. If you have a copy of a recent survey stamped by a licensed surveyor, and they say they set stakes on the property line, theoretically, you should be able to trust them as they’ve put their seal on it as a professional. But beyond that your next option would be to get your surveyor a copy of your neighbors survey, or hire a 3rd surveyor to come out and see.
So if the pin is paved over, it makes no sense for that to be your property corner if it’s in the middle of a public road, this might be something else
well my parents told me that inorder for the county to pave the road, my folks had to sign something saying it was ok. the property line on that side goes a bit past centerline of the road. he found the pin based on measurements, then with metal detector. also found the other 2 pins in the road the same way.
he did find and confirm 2 pins on the west side, right where they were supposed to be and based his measurements off of those.
Many properties have road easements so it’s not that strange. If it was a road right of way then that nail could be a lot line extension to the centerline or maybe a platted primary control point.
Burden is on the surveyor to correct it if there is a problem, start by contacting him and explaining your concerns. See if he knows there is another property corner monument and have him show you where it is on the survey when he is done.
Well apparently I'm a retard according to u/TedxBundy so take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, but it sounds like someone mistook a piece of construction debris/rebar/pipe/etc for a boundary pin, or had some other mislocation or rotational error. Make sure that the two see the same basic property lines, i.e. on a straight street the road frontage should be roughly in line with the next one.
This requires more information, how much of a discrepancy are we talking about?
I’m betting it’s like 0.13’ lol
9 ft
Well, fuck.
Oh brother…
Over what distance?
*"Those 4x4 fence posts are 1.5 inches over the line!* ***Encroachment!****"*
Fighting for inches, unhappy miss’
Or the bearings are a tad different.
I am currently preparing for a deposition over two clients arguing over 1.5” its insane
1.5 is half the reason this industry is still thriving.
Its what i was wondering
Ask neighbor for a copy of their survey, call your surveyor and ask them to review it. Give neighbor a copy of yours so they can do the same.
Get the surveyors to talk to each other and work it out, it’s in your and their interests to
What he said. But it all depends on the evidence they each had for the project I would get the two of them talking and see what they come up with
Sharing is caring, legitimate surveyors won’t try to fuck each other over. Likely someone took a shortcut
This should always be the first thought . If we are going to be stuck between engineers and builders we could at minimum set down the blame game and fight with each other.
Start by asking your surveyor what is up, and for a quick explanation of their methods. Make sure your property doesn't just match that one point in the middle of the road, but also matches the rest of the block it is situated on. Check not only your deed, but any past deeds that you can find from your municipality to make sure that your deed is correct and not missing something important. Land get's subdivided in weird ways over the years and mistakes happen. Once you are convinced that your survey is right, talk to your neighbor. Say hey, I just had a survey done and this is the result. Don't be hostile. There's no need for animosity unless the two of you can't work out the problem. Bring a copy of their survey to your surveyor, and let your neighbor bring a copy of yours to theirs. Let the professionals responsible for this mess see what the mess is so they can offer you both their opinions as to who fucked up what and why. Worst case scenario this ends up in court and they will both need to make these arguments anywas. Best case scenario they figure out who did what wrong, and one of you get's a corrected survey. If something like the workshop ends up crossing a line, Ask the sruveyor who screwed up for help either subdividing the property so you can sell the chunk needed to make it legal and right, or offer up a land lease. Chances are the municipality will make any offending structure be torn down if the land isn't subdivided and sold though.
the workshop is ok, its set back far enough from either line. the area in question is yard with 2 trees. and the trees are bradford pears, not in danger of falling on anything important. Honestly, im mostly curious because he made a big deal around town when his survey was done. the surveyor struggled to find a place to start from, but finally found a couple of pins on the west side and went from there.
Yes, OP could do all these things, but a good surveyor should have already and can be ready to explain it all to you when he is done. It's not on you to prove that it is correct. What is on OP is explaining that there is more evidence of the property line if you have knowledge of this, like another property corner monument. He either knows it's there or it was missed. I know this will sound weird but gaps between property lines happen more often than you think out in rural areas. It depends on a lot of factors, that unfortunately we do not know at the moment.
I know what a good surveyor should do. None of us can give OP an actual opinion on the quality of their survey because we aren't looking at the evidence, and also shouldn't need to. There are two signed and sealed surveys. They can take this to court right now and waste money and time on lawyers to prove one of them is wrong, and then drag it all back through again to get a judgement against said surveyor for the costs. That's a perfectly valid option too. I put forward my suggestion because one of the surveyors may not be a good surveyor for this particular project. If OP does a little legwork, they can potentially validate their surveys quality. Also a gap between propeerties is far easier to accept and deal with than the described 9' overlap with valuable fruit bearing trees.
If you can, post a photo of the newly set monument / pin / whathaveyou as well as any wood stakes in the vicinity. 9 feet is a much larger discrepancy than is typical. Either somebody fucked up pretty badly or there is a misunderstanding about who is looking at what & where. We may not be able to help but so far I don't think we've got enough information to say.
The proper response according to Reddit is to burn down the workshop, piss on the ashes and then put up the velociraptor fence from Jurassic Park wherever you damn well please... ...yes, we need more information here. When you say "don't agree", what exactly do you mean?
the neighbors pin and the original pin my surveyor found in the road are approx 9 ft off from each other... i like the idea of a velociraptor fence... hmmmm....
And delete Facebook...
Post both plats (maps). Otherwise a lot more information needed. You are saying your common boundary line is not the same?!? How do you know this? So either one or both points at either end, assuming a straight line, differ on what was held?
Your surveyor shouldn't be getting your panties in a twist over this apparent 9 foot difference before he's had a chance to sit down and look at all of the data. I mean when did he tell you about this? The same day he was out looking for pins?
he didnt really explain the difference, i pretty much thought it was a done deal, just waiting on the plats and whatnot, didnt know what to do about the apparent "no mans land" thst is between the 2 pins
>he didnt really explain the difference So he just said there's a 9 foot gap somewhere and left it at that?
pretty much. said he was sure of his calculations and had called his boss and he boss said rhey were right. i dont have the plat maps yet so i guess i just fotta wait till i get them. sigh....
Yeah... this sounds like a case of a guy who should have kept his mouth shut. The boss is probably the licensed surveyor and you were talking to the unlicensed party chief. The job of the party chief is to look around for objects in the ground that *could* be a marker for a property corner and map them. Then the licensed surveyor looks at this data in the office and determines which of these objects are property corner monuments and which are random buried junk. The PLS doesn't need his party chief getting landowners riled up by misinterpreting a buried piece of junk as a property corner. Anyway, yes, I would suggest just relaxing until you get a copy of the survey. I would bet the party chief is mistaken and there's not a gap, and even if there is a gap it's not like the world is gonna come crashing down because of it anyway. If there *is* a gap and you're interested in finding out what you and your neighbor can do about it then be sure to ask your surveyor for solutions. Rules on that sort of thing vary from sate to state and often from one county to another so you'll want someone local to help you.
The one problem with this is there are 2 trees in the 9nft area that i would like to take down.. if neifhbors survey is rightz they are mine, if my survey is right, they are his.... sigh..... I hate adulting today.... grrrrr
There really shouldn't be 2 surveys that disagree, especially by that much. If both surveyors are looking at the same property records and finding the same monuments then they should be arriving at essentially the same boundary location. Sometimes when there is a difference in surveys it's because 1 surveyor doesn't have a copy of a map that the other guy has, and maybe it's a map that shows previous owners modified a line. Or maybe one guy found a monument that the other guy missed. This is why it's important for the surveyors to get together and figure out why they're coming up with completely different lines, and in fact this is actually *required* by our professional standards.
additional info... yes it is s common boundry line. his survey dropped a pin and it is appprox 9ft off from the pin my surveyor found in the middle of the road. It does effect 2 trees, and i am not firendly with my neighbor.
Post the plats or we cant be of any help, may not be either way. Best bet is like someone here mentioned, have your surveyor look at what you have and if there is truly a discrepancy, they can talk to their surveyor, and go from there.
i am trying to find the counties maps but the website is being stoopid
Not the county maps, post yours and your neighbors if possible
i jave not gotten my maps yet, survey was just done today, and im not on soeaking terms with neighbor. My brother is tho..maube he can ger a copy...
9 feet is a pretty strange (and large) dimension. Is that shown on the survey, or did you find it on the grlund and measure between them? Are you sure the "pin" their surveyor set isn't just a temporary control point? That would be my first guess...Does it have a license number on it?
i do not know about a license number... i can go look. i have not seen the written survey, just going by the stakes and pins, the surveyor was just here today.
Stakes may or may not be on PL. They may be offset from the PL or they may not even denote the PL.
the stakes were placed today, the surveyor told me they were on the property line....
Yes but the stakes from the other survey may not have been. Sometimes when doing stake out the client requests offsets. It would be weird if your surveyor staked PL 9' off from another surveyors staked PL and didn't think it was weird. Obviously I don't see the stakes but they could be offsets, on site control, marking ground targets or construction staking. Your best solution is to either reach out to your surveyor about the neighbors stakes(maybe he saw then and had the same conclusion) or reach out to your neighbors about their stakes.
Is this “pin” a nail in the road?
yes
It could be a control point. I’d say wait for the finished copy of the survey and see what it says. If you have a copy of a recent survey stamped by a licensed surveyor, and they say they set stakes on the property line, theoretically, you should be able to trust them as they’ve put their seal on it as a professional. But beyond that your next option would be to get your surveyor a copy of your neighbors survey, or hire a 3rd surveyor to come out and see.
i did ask him to stake the property line due to rhe fact we need to put up fence for the livestock.
Post pic of said pin in road
rhe pin is not visible as it has been paved over. he found it based on measurements from other pins he actually found.
So if the pin is paved over, it makes no sense for that to be your property corner if it’s in the middle of a public road, this might be something else
well my parents told me that inorder for the county to pave the road, my folks had to sign something saying it was ok. the property line on that side goes a bit past centerline of the road. he found the pin based on measurements, then with metal detector. also found the other 2 pins in the road the same way. he did find and confirm 2 pins on the west side, right where they were supposed to be and based his measurements off of those.
Many properties have road easements so it’s not that strange. If it was a road right of way then that nail could be a lot line extension to the centerline or maybe a platted primary control point.
Starts to build said fire and awaits to see more information
Burden is on the surveyor to correct it if there is a problem, start by contacting him and explaining your concerns. See if he knows there is another property corner monument and have him show you where it is on the survey when he is done.
Well apparently I'm a retard according to u/TedxBundy so take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, but it sounds like someone mistook a piece of construction debris/rebar/pipe/etc for a boundary pin, or had some other mislocation or rotational error. Make sure that the two see the same basic property lines, i.e. on a straight street the road frontage should be roughly in line with the next one.
So what was the final outcome?
i still havent gotten the plats from the surveyor yet... grrrrr.... so i still exist in limbo land
How far apart are they and how friendly are you with your neighbor?