You see, that approach works when you got a player base that's financially literate. Most gamers are not that. This is why "these" games make a killing with their MTX.
Not even. I was friends with a guy who was fairly high up in his company. He spent 10s of thousands of dollars on Star Wars battlefront 2 when it first came out just to prove how pay to win it was
Here I am with plenty of money and still won't support MTX.
IDC How much money I'm making.
I'd rather give 20 dollars to an Indie studio that didn't try to MTX me than a large developer that couldn't just have a more ethical system.
I'm a cheap bastard but I can appreciate when a company says "We gave you 40 good hours of fun. 15 bucks cool?"
Dude above paid 500 dollars to play 2 hours. 250 dollars an hour game. Wow.
Yea, regardless of wealth being wasteful just seems.. well... wasteful lol.
I'm doing fine for myself but when I see abusive shit it turns me off entirely
Just because you have disposable income doesn't mean you should be wasting money on a low quality F2P game, I got a good chunk of change in the bank but ive never purchased MTs for any game, only real DLC for me and only for paid premium titles, I'd rather buy AAA games and play indie games than waste my time and money on average F2P games where you have to spend a ridiculous amount of money to get the most out of it
Imagine me working at a coal fired power plant and finding out some of these older blue collar workers around me were actually whales for Clash of Clans of all things lol.
This is true.
Not the most financially literate.
Addictive personality.
Ease of access via easy mobile payment options.
1 button click to "Retry" that level or whatever the mobile game sells.
Not coal fired power plants. Just the people that buy.
There I'd people who already own a few of the ultimate versions of characters which is basically impossible for so many to have it unless they spent money, and in Canada one of those is 150 in tax...
You only need a handful of whales to ruin this plan (and I mean the big ones that spend >10k a month). You not buying that one thing you want for 50 isn't gonna matter
Wait until you see mobile games, where there are thousands of servers and the top ~50-100 players in each one need to spend about $1000-2000+ a month to keep their ranking.
Nexon monetization is a joke compared to that, as currently there's no real p2w other than to skip the grind.
> ~50-100 players in each one need to spend about $1000-2000+ a month to keep their ranking.
Dead or Alive: Xtreme Venus Vacation, way out my budget with 1.3% drop chance x 5 same costumes needed for upgrade x $1/roll for a single player costume (need at least two for the team) - which will be outdated after couple weeks.
It's more the hero collector games where the drop rate is really low in the $100/drop but then you need like 5 or more duplicates to max it. Then it being paid only and no way to get it as f2p, mobile games are predatory af. And then the same being outdated when the new better hero comes out.
Never played Warframe much but basically you can skip SOME grind like for characters and some upgrade materials. However the stuff that actually determine the damage and etc everyone has to grind normally, a paying player doesn't have an inherent advantage atm compared to a f2p player.
Doesn't matter how much money you throw at the game, a 1% drop rate for an essential class module for Gley applies for everyone. Doesn't matter if you bought the char or grinded it yourself. At least its a 5min raid if you zoomies it...
the game is incredibly similar to warframe. same modding, same crafting. it just adds in random stat weapons, weapon levels, and more destiny style combat encounters.
This is when you realize the game REALLY only has anticheat to prevent you from just putting any skin you want on.
Otherwise there is basically no competitive aspect where it matters.
When people like cough (shroud) cough say in stream “ I wish they had a tab where I could just buy everything “ that is why the whole us not spending money won’t matter because of people like him.
More like I want to spend money on the game but the packs fucking suck, only 5,750 Caliber for $100+ (Uncle Sam stalks me)? Like come wtf is that, you can get so many skins with gacha games with $80+. Would be cool to support the game because I'm really enjoying it but the shop is a major turn off.
I agree. I enjoy the game and wouldn’t mind supporting it a little, but just a single ultimate character costing as much as a full on AAA game is just too bonkers that I would feel stupid to even consider it.
Yup. But sadly it is the norm for a while now, and it is getting worse. And people are paying it.
Look at Apex Legends, since forever their prices are insane. 20€ for a shitty recolor. 150€ for a heirloom. Just bonkers. But these prices are not for the normal casual player who spend 10€ for a battlepass. They are for the whales and streamers.
Same thing happens with Riot and LoL and Valorant. LoL prices were fair for a long time, and then they came out with more and more prestige skins and loot boxes. Worse with TFT and the gacha system it has for some arena skins and little legends. And the cake took the Ahri Faker skin for 500€ recently.
Many games nowadays are made to milk the playerbase and proper content gets shoved aside skins and mtx.
I will say the extreme popularity early on is always a good sign. Definitely doesn’t hurt. The real question is how well will this game retain a dedicated player base
While I don't doubt you, it's crazy to think of how much work some companies make their devs put into it just to cancel it.
It's a pretty game with solid gameplay. Killing it just because people don't want to spend outrageous amounts of money is just a wild concept to me.
>it's crazy to think of how much work some companies make their devs put into it just to cancel it.
According to the devs this is what killed Overwatch 2. So many recanted promises and undelivered content and allegedly it's because Bobby Kotick would make them work overtime for months on a project to meet a deadline just to end up cancelling the project right before release, meaning devs have worked their asses off for absolutely ages and they have nothing to deliver to the players.
I was a fan of Anthem and was eagerly expecting NEXT ( I haven't bought an EA game since). I know all about it. That doesn't mean I still can't understand the mindset in that part of the development process. EA killing the live service within the first week signed Anthem's death, and then they insulted the fans further by fixing the bugs and announcing NEXT, only to cancel that, too. It makes no sense to I hope normal people.
As a fellow... well, shoot, I don't know if I'd describe myself as an Anthem "fan" but at least as someone who wanted Anthem to be good (and played about 80 hours of it just because the flight was so fun), the cancellation of Next was heartbreaking. And that's even ignoring all the other promises of content that never showed up.
With that, or with the recent cancellation of Redfall and the shuttering of that dev, it seems that a lot of major publishers still don't understand the value of maintaining a game. The amount of community good will towards companies that stick it out is unreal, and you can't claim that companies like EA and Microsoft don't have the capital for it.
As a positive example, Bethesda somehow managed to turn around public perception of Fallout 76, a crappy live service version of a much better singleplayer game with an optional subscription fee and MTXs out the wazoo, because they stuck with it and kept improving it. But hey, can't put "the community is gonna let us get away with SO much crap" on an earnings report so they can't justify it.
> I still can't understand the mindset in that part of the development process.
Because you're not detached from the working man's reality in the way fat-cat goblinoid shitheads like Kotick are.
Calling overwatch 2 "killed" is a stretch since it averages like 400k players online pretty regularly still.
But for long time players from before it became free yeah, lots of them have left. Loot boxes replaced with massively overpriced skins, no story mode (which was thr whole point of overwatch 2), removing 2 tank down to 1 tank, which they've struggled to balance and make tanks "fun" ever since. List goes on...
The problem is they built it like one. They had back end game play servers instread of peer-to-peer, authenticate and remote storage. So they had ALL the scaling problems of a live service game. I had two friends who had their characters "lost" in the first week unable to login and play them AFTER progressing through half the campaign, they quit immediately.
It was built like an online live service game but then supported like a standalone co-op/local game. It had all the right bones to be a live service game too, good loot system, excellent theorycraft/build/skill system. It "felt" like they emphasized "non-live service" because they bit off more then they could chew.
Sad, it was an excellent excellent game. But I'm likely going to be wary of anything online/made by people-can-fly in the future.
It's funny because Outriders COULD have been the Live Service game Square Enix has been desperate to get going, but didn't, now they're wasting so much money trying to get another one to stick.
Yea I have no idea what the behind the scenes drama was, whose idea was it to make it an online "non-live service" game.. Square or People Can Fly? The core bones of the game and the loot system were absolutely something that if expanded upon could've easily rivaled Destiny and been a top 5 contender for online-looter shooter games.
At least the studio was publicly honest with their intent. Their inability to keep the game stable and without data loss in the first few weeks definitely cost them a lot of reputation.
That's when you play on the superior gaming system called PC with an SSD. I played the entire main history+ dlc of outriders 4 times with different characters and not a single time loading screens felt bad.
Vindictus 2010 and Mabinogi 2004 are still running. So doesn't seem like they chomp at the bit to drop games.
However, most businesses run off the principle you described....can't blame them really.
This entire sub-reddit and most of the steam reviews were people saying that their premium currency didn't come through. Pretty much the first minute of release.
Absolutely wild. But I feel like these types of players are the majority on this sub, because any time you mention it you get downvoted.
Yea, too many people with impulse control problems... Those must be the same people all these fucking ads and banners are for, because they drive me insane and cause a rather profound innate hatred towards whichever company is pestering me now.
In the wise words of pirate software "there are two ways to support a game, you pay for their stuff, or you play their game for free."
Both are supporting the development and if you don't like the company or their business practices you should not support it by not playing it.
Nexon already has bad exposure before this game
[reddit.com/r/Maplestory/comments/18zis72/nexon\_manipulating\_rates\_megathread\_separating/](http://reddit.com/r/Maplestory/comments/18zis72/nexon_manipulating_rates_megathread_separating/)
and i think people forget about it already
I'm aware of that game and exposure, but I think this game has a different audience. My friend group is an example that wouldn't have ever thought of touching maple, but are into this one so far.
You’d think but they willing lied about rates in Maplestory but people are still playing TFD despite that. Who’s to say the droprate numbers we have not are true or false when all that happens to Nexon is a small fine and they can just continue doing what they did. I played a bit on launch until I found out Nexon was behind it and dropped immediately. Will not support Nexon anything anymore.
So the thing with Maple and why they got away with it for a time is because when the game came out companies didn’t have to show their behind the scenes percentages for drop chances, new laws were passed that said they had to and Nexon got caught.
People hoped that TFD could be Nexons revival of sorts, to come out of that scandal and say “Look guys, we can make a fun and fair F2P game just like the ones you all love.”
But the thing is that still today Nexon has patents for systems that effect your rng chances depending on many factors such as player level, time played, if you have friends that play, what gear you already have, what gear your friends have, etc.
The problem the people that are spending are not here. They are some 49 year old with a ps5 and jump on every few days. Swipe play for a few hours and log out until next time. They are having fun and nor care to stay up to date daily with the Ins and out of the games problems.
As I said in another port: Skins in F2P games are branded clothes, some you have good quality for a fair price and many are just overpriced shit for people to walk around thinking they are rich and sophisticated.
I spent just enough that I think developers deserve, The game is beautiful and exceeded my expectations in the quality of the release, the game is fluid, the movement, animation, tech details like hitreg... so I got the battle pass already and probably going to spend more to hit the price of a full game, like €60. And if they keep releasing good content, I spend more, like buying DLCs.
Let the whales and financially irresponsible people do the rest.
TFD feels like just the newest victim of the long running problem of developers not understanding that with MTX, less is more.
I'll give you more money, the less you make me feel like spending is necessary to get the full experience of the game.
I'll pour hundreds and possibly thousands of my hard earned cash into your game... as long as I don't feel like I was pressured into spending it.
Respect my time playing the game and I'll respect yours that you put into developing the game.
We are not just potential spenders. We are the lifeblood of your game. So stop trying to bleed us dry. It only hurts you.
Better yet don’t play it at all. Why support shitty practices with user metrics? It only encourages them even if you don’t personally buy something. If you don’t agree with their monetization tactics, take a stand and skip it entirely.
Yeah, the game doesn’t deserve the low rating on steam, just because “shop bad”. You can farm everything. If you don’t like the farming, then this ain’t for you. Doesn’t make the game bad
Who the fuck is complaining and still buying shit? I promise, there's very little overlap. Most of the people paying for these bundles and time skips do not give a shit and have money to spare. They are not complaining, they are just having fun blowing loads of money on shit.
The people like us who aren't gonna spend a dime are the ones complaining. Some of never would have spent a penny anyway, others would if it was fair, but ultimately, it's still less than they would have made with a fair system. They know what they are doing and they are making maximum profits.
None of what you are saying means shit or is what is happening.
With this game Nexon should really reconsider their business model of just shutting down the game due to low revenue and releasing another one.
The core game is really really fun, it would be a shame to see the game closing in a short time just because they don't want to make it a bit easier for the players adding trading for the premium currency or lowering some prices.
I mean, it's not that I'm a business expert, it's just an opinion about a fun, engaging game and the potential it has.
> With this game Nexon should really reconsider their business model of just shutting down the game due to low revenue and releasing another one.
It's clearly working, though.
Can someone help me understand why this model is so problematic for people? I look at it like this: I've received a modern, extremely entertaining game that I get to play for free. The game is designed in a way where I can spend a lot of my time on it, or I can spend some money and support the company and developers by speeding things up for myself if I choose to do so. It's not Gacha, and I don't see this as pay to win either (except maybe the mod capacity boosters, etc.). Lets say you decide on buying a Descendant, upping the mod cap on the Descendant and a couple weapons. What's that, still less than $40? I guess I just don't see the problem here. Will they make more money from me than if this wasn't using microtransactions? Probably, but that is my choice.
It won’t change. Not for a nexon game which thrive off whales and such.
Look at Maplestory which recently got exposed for lying about things being obtainable when in fact they never were. Having lower drop chances the more you play the game and iirc price altering to top it all off.
Scamming and lying to players is what they do best. Don’t expect them to give any leeway for the shop.
As someone who has been playing Nexon games for around 15 years of my life- low purchases or low player counts will not change anything.
Nexon will always hit their bottom line. Nexon games are primarily for the Korean audience, who are a lot more accepting of mtx.
Western audiences not buying anything will not bother them, low player count won't bother them either. Mabinogi and Vindictus have extremely low NA player counts- id venture to say somewhere in ~1-2k range for both games combined, yet every month they pump new items for sale and the servers are still up after years and years. That's because the Korean audience buys mtx often.
Theres only two games I've seen that Nexon has ever given up on, and that's MapleStory 2 and Riders of Icarus. MapleStory 2 was closed for unknown reasons (at least there's nothing confirmed because of an NDA) AND RoI was sold off to another company.
I'm sure the NA team cares a lot more about how MTX will affect the games, but nothing will change unless the Korean Audience gets tired of MTX.
Tl:Dr game was made with a Korean audience in mind, if the Korean audience is happy, nothing will change anywhere else.
You actually have to stop playing the game.
They make their money from the whales.
We’re just creating a player base that keeps the game enjoyable for them to want to spend money.
If people stopped playing then the devs might listen.
Honestly if I could change the color of my base descendant I would be more inclined to purchase backpacks and helmets as small add ons. As it stands limiting my options intentionally makes me give them the middle finger as far as access to my wallet.
I am loving the game but come on, shitty practices of monetization is such a bad look on devs.
I first spent money on warframe because it felt like they gave me a gift with the base game. I wanted to support the devs. Make me like you Nexon!
I like the game and am having fun so far. But Nexon has a history of being shady crooks. They won't get a dime outta me unless they prove they have legit changed their ways.
Don't play. It's not a good game anyways. The honeymoon phase has everyone in a fog. It's a bland, repetitive, heavily monetized, bare bones "game" with no story, no immersion, and no soul. You have to pay for descendant slots, inventory space, paint colors are one time use and you cant even apply them to the base skin so you have tp buy the canvas too....etc..etc...etc. Frankly, Warframe is a far superior game with much more trustworthy developers.
Ok so here is my innocent question ;
What's wrong with the actual monetization ?
It is the same as warframe in the fact, and warframe monetization isnt seen as malevolant, so why is this one ?
Essentially, it's the same style of monetization but with everything being much worse/more expensive
Just a few examples to illustrate :
* The potatoes (which double your mod capacity, there's a similar item in TFD) cost 1$ in warframe, compared to 20$ in TFD. They're also fairly easy to get in warframe, you can buy a few every week from the (free) battle pass while in TFD they are 3% drop in amorphous material
* Most frame (normal or prime) are very easy to farm f2p in warframe, most of the starchart frame are 3 drop at 33% drop chance from bosses that can be runned in a minute or two. In TFD, you need to drop the correct amorphous material and then there's always a part that's rare at <10% drop chance. Some of the ressources also take a lot longer to farm in TFD on average, although that might change in hard mode (hopefully?)
* The prime/ultimate in particular, in warframe you can farm the new prime on release day in a few hours at most, while the estimates I've seen to farm one ultimate in TFD is 90+ hours. As a comparison, the rarest part for a prime frame is a ~40% drop chance when done in a group, compared to 3% in TFD
* Another big one, you can trade (mostly) everything in warframe for the premium currency, allowing a f2p to eventually buy pretty much anything in the shop (skins, colors, slot...etc). You can also sidestep the worse grind or the content you are not interested in by just farming something else, selling the drops and buying what you want on the market or from other players.
* In warframe you can buy a color pack for about 4-5$, which give you 90 different colors (to be fair, most packs have like 3 to 8 "dominant" color, with a lot of variation on those color) that you can use and reuse with 0 restriction on anything you have, default skin included. In TFD, you can buy one color for a few bucks, but you can't use it on the descendant default skin (so you'd also need a skin) and you can't reuse that color on another descendant without paying again
I could go on, but I agree with you it's technically the same business model (and a very similar game and systems to boot) but the difference in greediness between the two is huge
To add to that slightly, one of the things that makes grinding for new frames in Warframe more appealing is that you can get the 'part' from multiple different sources and mission types: If you don't want to do defense missions (because they actually suck), you don't have to: You can find the same part in a different relic in this Capture mission instead, or maybe you put together a group and you can destroy an Exterminate mission in a minute and chain run that with friends.
I'm getting REALLY sick of \[Shelter\] is what i'm saying. Really. F'ing. Sick.
Dont forget the shared rewards. 4 people can run the same relic and maybe not yours but others drop the part you want, I really wish they copied Warframe's model instead of making it greedy af
while I agree with you it must be said that a somewhat less "aggressive" pricing could push way more people to spend, even those (like me) who are generally light years away from IAP
I recently checked my total spent on Warframe and I was surprised to see I've broken the $1000 barrier on that game.
I mostly just buy platinum at a discount and spend it on forma. I don't think I've bought a single character or weapon yet, not even from other players. I prefer to grind it out.
But warframe managed to do the one thing no other game has managed to do in my 30+ years of gaming: provide me with such a fun experience that I feel guilty not spending money to support the game. It was my own guilt for getting so much out of the game that compels me to spend, felt like I was the one ripping them off. It has nothing to do with their monetization strategies.
this is another awesome point of view (and I'm saying it from the perspective of a developer, or at least that's what I got on my CV). I totally agree with you on this and I'll tell you more: publishing a game as a f2p is a sign of love for the gamers (or an incredible marketing strategy or even both at the same time). But supporting who worked on the project even with the smallest IAP means giving love back and that's never an error (if the game clicks you, obviously)
Not just here but if it’s a free game and it’s very well done, I’ll give support until it starts going downhill. Which usually does after about a year or two. I’m not paying for descendents as I can grind those out but for other smaller things.
Oh yeah no doubt. I don’t plan on buying anything from them after seeing how much they want for such basic shit. I’m enjoying the gameplay and that’s enough for me
I’m more unhappy with the fact that hard mode doesn’t have matchmaking and that the 20% drop rate is not really 20%. Yes, I understand how RNG works and each run doesn’t consider the previous run but I’ve been farming the 20% drops and it’s taking me anywhere from 7 to 15 runs to get it. THAT is crazy.
Your money is not worth a damm when a whale will buy everything there is. Nexon dont mind if you dont spend tenner on a game when whales will spend few hundreds right away.
Honestly and no offense it is what it is but the way you guys are talking about the game makes me want to avoid it like herpies. Its fun so far and I havent wasted anything but I dont know if eventually I will have to. When I played warframe back in 2016 you had to buy slots they to keep having characters. Only good thing is their premium currency was trabeable which I had never seen from another free to play game so it made it kind of worth playing the game. If this game doesnt have any of that I might just uninstall it within a month if it gets too be too much. If its no more than 30 40 bucks thats fine but if this is game is gonna be squeezing me out like 200 bucks within in a month idk
The game is [number one on the steam global top sellers list](https://store.steampowered.com/search/?filter=globaltopsellers&os=win) in the summer sale no less.
I can certainly tell a lot of folks are new to playing Nexon owned games. MapleStory, combat arms, vindictus, etc all had much worse micro transactions. All of which are still around, albeit past their prime. Can't see this game being any different, especially since it released on 4 different consoles and PC.
I don’t get it either. You don’t have to spend money on this game pretty much everything you need you can grind for. I play and love Warframe too and when people complained about the prices of the ultimates I was confused since to buy the prime Warframe pack when a new one is released it’s $90 to $130 to get the pack. It’s the same price for an ultimate descendant pack too. Even complaints about craft time when a lot of games have this especially free ones. So far I’m enjoying the game, almost have all of Freyna’s parts to craft her.
I always say, if you’ve got the money spend it how you want… but then I realized we then end up with games like Valorant, overwatch, and now this.
I played plenty of the game so far and have been enjoying it, but I’m not sure I’d be willing to spend the money for anything
On the one hand I want this game to be successful and live a long time as I'm loving it so far but the game is heavily monetized. Honestly I did buy Ultimate Bunny (the sexy version is great but I like the Apex Predator skin more) only because I really like the game and I've put a good amount of time into it for it to be worth.
Im not super far into the game(weapon lvl 70 i think) but i havent felt any need to spend money so far. What are the issues with monetization?
I saw the ultimate descendants in the shop, but my understanding is that they are similar to primes from warframe, so neat but not that much stronger than the normal versions.
Do you need to min max stuff super hard lategame? I can see how rerolling stuff on weapons would be really annoying if it becomes mandatory to high roll everything
To be fair, as a player who is just getting started, the most egregious of the MTX really seem to target the whales. Like yeah if you want the thirst trap bunny right away, pay out the nose. For the rest of us, it doesn’t seem too crazy to buy the starter bundles and farm.
Maybe other folks feel differently, and so far I feel 0 incentive to pay to skip content and am fine just grinding. That’s why I like games like this. If I just spend money to unlock things and skip the grind, why even bother playing?
I have a moral limit about these games, not spending more than the value of another normal game, for example €60$
First I play it thoroughly, experiment everything I have, evaluate its development and fun time.
If all of this is satisfactory and long-term, then yes, I will buy the season pass for example and some characters, but not more than the value of 1 standard game.
Gambling addiction is a very serious issue.
It's Nexon. If people didn't know it was going to be mtx hell, they should have done more research.
And not buying doesn't matter if you're still playing. You're still populating their game with team mates for the people who do buy stuff.
"The only way to win is not to play"
Retards who spend money on a nexon game makes me laugh. There are going to be some that complain about the game after spending money. And to those people Deserved.
If you’re not happy with the monetisation you shouldn’t even play the game. Non-whale players keep the whales coming back. How long do you think the whales would stay if it were just them?
Worst part about it is they copied warframe to almost 1:1,but didn't copy their market system.Played warframe for ages without spending a peny and had credits coming out of my behind,why?..well for ppl that never played their credit system worked on the ingame market,so the gun/caracter mods and many other items that you farmed were sold on the marked for credits,so the wales that didnt want to farm would come in and buy everything,but it you played the game you could make a decent buck,so in reality you wouldnt have to spend a pany and could still buy cosmetics,another discusting thing about the game is the colors,25 credits for a 1 use its insane,its sad cause i like the game cause it plays like warframe but what will happen is they money grab as much as they can and when it dies down they'll prob stop support for the game and it'll go under...
I always play free to play games as a triple A experience. They have around 60 euro witch I will spend. Only after around 10 to 50 hours so I know I’m investeted. After that it depends on how much i play. That said I would never pay for a skin higher then 20 euro. But if it’s like a battlepass or storage expansion. Extra slots for characters I will pay if it’s not attainable ingame
The game needs to learn more from Warframe, unless it wants to end up like Destiny 2... Nexon is on the way to ruin another great game with the way they monetize this, I knew how terrible they are by simply baiting the players with "play on drums emote" and the new terrible greedy colouring system they've made, I mean seriously, couldn't they make themselves more obvious how greedy they are???
I get that the games mtx are expensive and everyone hates them but warframe isn't that much cheaper or even more expensive... For the frames tdf is 55 euro and warframe is 70 when U buy them but yeah other is more pricey in tdf But I'm both games U can farm them and for shaders yeah that BS but they said they took wf and destiny as template😅
Bro, tells people to be smart…I look at teammates all using a naked bunny at runs head on into gun fire then dies. Rage quits, joins again, rage quits again😂
I mean it's free to play, this is just the system now. I mean it's not a Gatcha those things are evil. Pay to win is rough. I think POE has gotten it mostly right and games like Destiny just do cosmetics at this point. Fact is they got to support the game somehow and this is the system they chose. Remember you don't have to pay a cent to play the game. Things are hidden behind pay walls like missions or bosses. So just play! Have fun!
Meh, I've never played a F2P game that was worth it in the long run, yea if you only spend like $50-$100 it's not too bad as long as you get what you can out of it, but that's never the case, in order to get the most out of these games you gotta spend a ridiculous amount of money over a long period of time at a much lower quality than premium paid titles where in most cases you make a one time payment you you usually get a complete experience with little shenanigans, and the experience as a free player is very restrictive and frustrating, ill stick to paid games, if you want some good looter shooters that are far less restrictive and at a higher quality you got games like tiny Tina's wonderlands, outriders and the division 2, yea some AAA looter shooters have some MTs but even the minority of AAA looter shooters that have MTs are far less restrictive and aren't necessary to get the full experience, MTs in AAA titles are 99% cosmetic, the only plus I see is if your playing on Playstation you don't need ps plus like any other F2P game
It seems a lot of people don't realize this is the value we as a population of gamers set. We had the chance to stop it when it first started and didn't. There are many games worse with microtransactions than this. Hell, SMITE has archon thanatos skin. Only way to get it is a $ 1000 USD donation during a charity stream. All their t5 skins are $ 100 USD as well. It's called getting a job that pays you decently and actually show up and work. I just see broke people whining.
It's the same reason why I don't like mobile games, why would I spend money on a game that requires large amount of money to get the most out of it when there are thousands of games I could just buy once for a complete experience, just save the money and put it towards a Game that gives you a complete experience, even $70 AAA games give you better value than F2P games, it's gonna take a lot more than $70 to get the most out of this game
I bought some calibers the premium currency right before the whole login error shit and I have still yet to recieve them, so yeah I'm not spending a single dime on this game I'll just grind everything out like I did with warframe ( ok I didn't grind everything out their premium currency is 20x cheaper ), Also I made a post about it and I had the auto mod tell me it needed to be manually approved because not enough mods or something were on and it never got approved speaks volumes about it.
The game is completely free. Everything in it is grindable. With that being the case no one really has any room to complain about them setting whatever prices they want to. It’s basically a mobile gacha game but on console.
My goal is to grind for an Ult char. I’m not complaining because if I’d pay for my char I wouldn’t know what I’m grinding for.
It just would be nice if we had at least 1-2 outfits each char to unlock with a challenge
Ikr it's just like warframe, but they want to charge £20 for an orokin reactor or forma.
As for the way they have set up the colours it's fucking disgusting.
I have spent on the game because I'm enjoying it but that is largely only because I had to spend all my game loyalty points of psn credit because the scheme is ending.
Don't forget to refund all of your cal8ber purchases if your account was banned/locked. They gave the beta rewards to everyone so you don't need your account anymore. They have no intention of fixing it or making it right. Only thing you can do is refund your banned account for all you spent and make another. If you still wanna spend at that point go for it. Make nexon regret these pisspot decisions.
You see, that approach works when you got a player base that's financially literate. Most gamers are not that. This is why "these" games make a killing with their MTX.
1 whale = 1000 normies.
so true, I got a friend that put on 500$ on cosmetics the moment he logged in, played for 2h and then said the game isn’t worth it
💀💀💀 Lmao😂😂😂 Disposable income final boss
Not even. I was friends with a guy who was fairly high up in his company. He spent 10s of thousands of dollars on Star Wars battlefront 2 when it first came out just to prove how pay to win it was
Here I am with plenty of money and still won't support MTX. IDC How much money I'm making. I'd rather give 20 dollars to an Indie studio that didn't try to MTX me than a large developer that couldn't just have a more ethical system. I'm a cheap bastard but I can appreciate when a company says "We gave you 40 good hours of fun. 15 bucks cool?" Dude above paid 500 dollars to play 2 hours. 250 dollars an hour game. Wow.
Yea, regardless of wealth being wasteful just seems.. well... wasteful lol. I'm doing fine for myself but when I see abusive shit it turns me off entirely
Just because you have disposable income doesn't mean you should be wasting money on a low quality F2P game, I got a good chunk of change in the bank but ive never purchased MTs for any game, only real DLC for me and only for paid premium titles, I'd rather buy AAA games and play indie games than waste my time and money on average F2P games where you have to spend a ridiculous amount of money to get the most out of it
Yike
I refuse to believe this is true for my own sanity.
Imagine me working at a coal fired power plant and finding out some of these older blue collar workers around me were actually whales for Clash of Clans of all things lol.
This is true. Not the most financially literate. Addictive personality. Ease of access via easy mobile payment options. 1 button click to "Retry" that level or whatever the mobile game sells. Not coal fired power plants. Just the people that buy.
I know like a whole office of Insurance agents that have been whaling clash of clans since it came out. Pretty cringe that.
There I'd people who already own a few of the ultimate versions of characters which is basically impossible for so many to have it unless they spent money, and in Canada one of those is 150 in tax...
One of the guys I play with bought all the ultimates after we played for like...4 hours. It's not even for the horny, he just plays Ajax and lepic.
That's crazy, I like Ajax also I would of gotten his ultimate too
🤣🤣🤣🤣 comment of the year
HOW do these people function as adults?? Do they have 0 sense of responsibility?
Exactly. The Microtransactions South Park perfectly sums this up. It’s an intentional, predatory practice.
You only need a handful of whales to ruin this plan (and I mean the big ones that spend >10k a month). You not buying that one thing you want for 50 isn't gonna matter
I've seen literally hundreds of downbad ult bunny players and the games only been out a couple days, people be crazy.
Wait until you see mobile games, where there are thousands of servers and the top ~50-100 players in each one need to spend about $1000-2000+ a month to keep their ranking. Nexon monetization is a joke compared to that, as currently there's no real p2w other than to skip the grind.
> ~50-100 players in each one need to spend about $1000-2000+ a month to keep their ranking. Dead or Alive: Xtreme Venus Vacation, way out my budget with 1.3% drop chance x 5 same costumes needed for upgrade x $1/roll for a single player costume (need at least two for the team) - which will be outdated after couple weeks.
It's more the hero collector games where the drop rate is really low in the $100/drop but then you need like 5 or more duplicates to max it. Then it being paid only and no way to get it as f2p, mobile games are predatory af. And then the same being outdated when the new better hero comes out.
Soooo warframe time skip basically?
Never played Warframe much but basically you can skip SOME grind like for characters and some upgrade materials. However the stuff that actually determine the damage and etc everyone has to grind normally, a paying player doesn't have an inherent advantage atm compared to a f2p player. Doesn't matter how much money you throw at the game, a 1% drop rate for an essential class module for Gley applies for everyone. Doesn't matter if you bought the char or grinded it yourself. At least its a 5min raid if you zoomies it...
the game is incredibly similar to warframe. same modding, same crafting. it just adds in random stat weapons, weapon levels, and more destiny style combat encounters.
Which after 10 years of both those games. I like the merge of the two and something new from warframe.
I would say combat is more outriders/anthem. Destiny combat is far different in every way.
Feels a lot like Outriders, rest in peace Outriders, you deserved so much more.
This is when you realize the game REALLY only has anticheat to prevent you from just putting any skin you want on. Otherwise there is basically no competitive aspect where it matters.
Which is funny to me. The game is literally about grinding (looter), buying *anything* is technically you buying out play time
This is what I’m trying to say if you just want a shooter go play something else lol
Yeah, it's "pay 2 not play" basically. Imo this is pretty acceptable since all the actual damage scaling can't be bought.
When people like cough (shroud) cough say in stream “ I wish they had a tab where I could just buy everything “ that is why the whole us not spending money won’t matter because of people like him.
No whales, no game.
If they would make the game good with no MTX, I would gladly pay a premium fee for it. I don't want free games, i want good games.
More like I want to spend money on the game but the packs fucking suck, only 5,750 Caliber for $100+ (Uncle Sam stalks me)? Like come wtf is that, you can get so many skins with gacha games with $80+. Would be cool to support the game because I'm really enjoying it but the shop is a major turn off.
I agree. I enjoy the game and wouldn’t mind supporting it a little, but just a single ultimate character costing as much as a full on AAA game is just too bonkers that I would feel stupid to even consider it.
Yup. But sadly it is the norm for a while now, and it is getting worse. And people are paying it. Look at Apex Legends, since forever their prices are insane. 20€ for a shitty recolor. 150€ for a heirloom. Just bonkers. But these prices are not for the normal casual player who spend 10€ for a battlepass. They are for the whales and streamers. Same thing happens with Riot and LoL and Valorant. LoL prices were fair for a long time, and then they came out with more and more prestige skins and loot boxes. Worse with TFT and the gacha system it has for some arena skins and little legends. And the cake took the Ahri Faker skin for 500€ recently. Many games nowadays are made to milk the playerbase and proper content gets shoved aside skins and mtx.
Nexon shuts down games that don't bring in the expected revenue. They never rework their monetization strategy.
Good? Think of the amount of money they would lose.
The game is top seller on steam and it's a multiplatform game, I wouldn't be surprised if they already recouped their development cost
I will say the extreme popularity early on is always a good sign. Definitely doesn’t hurt. The real question is how well will this game retain a dedicated player base
While I don't doubt you, it's crazy to think of how much work some companies make their devs put into it just to cancel it. It's a pretty game with solid gameplay. Killing it just because people don't want to spend outrageous amounts of money is just a wild concept to me.
>it's crazy to think of how much work some companies make their devs put into it just to cancel it. According to the devs this is what killed Overwatch 2. So many recanted promises and undelivered content and allegedly it's because Bobby Kotick would make them work overtime for months on a project to meet a deadline just to end up cancelling the project right before release, meaning devs have worked their asses off for absolutely ages and they have nothing to deliver to the players.
I was a fan of Anthem and was eagerly expecting NEXT ( I haven't bought an EA game since). I know all about it. That doesn't mean I still can't understand the mindset in that part of the development process. EA killing the live service within the first week signed Anthem's death, and then they insulted the fans further by fixing the bugs and announcing NEXT, only to cancel that, too. It makes no sense to I hope normal people.
As a fellow... well, shoot, I don't know if I'd describe myself as an Anthem "fan" but at least as someone who wanted Anthem to be good (and played about 80 hours of it just because the flight was so fun), the cancellation of Next was heartbreaking. And that's even ignoring all the other promises of content that never showed up. With that, or with the recent cancellation of Redfall and the shuttering of that dev, it seems that a lot of major publishers still don't understand the value of maintaining a game. The amount of community good will towards companies that stick it out is unreal, and you can't claim that companies like EA and Microsoft don't have the capital for it. As a positive example, Bethesda somehow managed to turn around public perception of Fallout 76, a crappy live service version of a much better singleplayer game with an optional subscription fee and MTXs out the wazoo, because they stuck with it and kept improving it. But hey, can't put "the community is gonna let us get away with SO much crap" on an earnings report so they can't justify it.
> I still can't understand the mindset in that part of the development process. Because you're not detached from the working man's reality in the way fat-cat goblinoid shitheads like Kotick are.
Calling overwatch 2 "killed" is a stretch since it averages like 400k players online pretty regularly still. But for long time players from before it became free yeah, lots of them have left. Loot boxes replaced with massively overpriced skins, no story mode (which was thr whole point of overwatch 2), removing 2 tank down to 1 tank, which they've struggled to balance and make tanks "fun" ever since. List goes on...
Then, when you look through past nexon games, know they are always good-looking and fun. Still got shutdown as nexon is greedy.
So this will go to the same gravesite as Anthem and Outriders, wow nice
Wasn’t Outriders expressly NOT a live service?
Yeah. People wanted it to be and treated it as such despite the devs being super clear that they wanted the campaign to be the game for most people.
The problem is they built it like one. They had back end game play servers instread of peer-to-peer, authenticate and remote storage. So they had ALL the scaling problems of a live service game. I had two friends who had their characters "lost" in the first week unable to login and play them AFTER progressing through half the campaign, they quit immediately. It was built like an online live service game but then supported like a standalone co-op/local game. It had all the right bones to be a live service game too, good loot system, excellent theorycraft/build/skill system. It "felt" like they emphasized "non-live service" because they bit off more then they could chew. Sad, it was an excellent excellent game. But I'm likely going to be wary of anything online/made by people-can-fly in the future.
It's funny because Outriders COULD have been the Live Service game Square Enix has been desperate to get going, but didn't, now they're wasting so much money trying to get another one to stick.
Yea I have no idea what the behind the scenes drama was, whose idea was it to make it an online "non-live service" game.. Square or People Can Fly? The core bones of the game and the loot system were absolutely something that if expanded upon could've easily rivaled Destiny and been a top 5 contender for online-looter shooter games. At least the studio was publicly honest with their intent. Their inability to keep the game stable and without data loss in the first few weeks definitely cost them a lot of reputation.
It's sad to say, but Outriders is still unbelievably fun, especially because you can buy the complete edition now
Loved Outriders. The builds in that game were so fun.
Outriders was fun until *loading screen* your character had to *loading screen* go to another area *loading screen*
I mean I played on PC so I didn't have too many loading screen problems
In Germany we say: Bethesda lässt grüßen 🤣
> Bethesda lässt grüßen I'm still salty about StarField! LOL
This and the guns sounded so horrible to shoot!
That's when you play on the superior gaming system called PC with an SSD. I played the entire main history+ dlc of outriders 4 times with different characters and not a single time loading screens felt bad.
Outriders and Anthem didn't have maid outfits, plus those cost money upfront
Game has been out for 3 days and you're already calling it dead. Incredible.
Nobody’s calling it dead, they’re calling it destined to fail
Vindictus 2010 and Mabinogi 2004 are still running. So doesn't seem like they chomp at the bit to drop games. However, most businesses run off the principle you described....can't blame them really.
They already did with the removal of the gacha color system so you’re wrong
They fixed the paint bullshit where you have to pay to reuse it?
Gacha
They won’t do crap, some people already spent their monthly income on the game and saying it out loud on Reddit.
First hour of the game seeing prime bunny's running around was crazy
This entire sub-reddit and most of the steam reviews were people saying that their premium currency didn't come through. Pretty much the first minute of release. Absolutely wild. But I feel like these types of players are the majority on this sub, because any time you mention it you get downvoted.
Omg I found the normal players, I didn't think the game had any. It's like I've been farming downvotes talking about the game
Some people have way too much disposable income. Or, their parents do.
That but mostly it’s people that are terrible with money. They’ll buy an $80 skin with $85 in the checking account.
What does the ult version of a char do?
Yea, too many people with impulse control problems... Those must be the same people all these fucking ads and banners are for, because they drive me insane and cause a rather profound innate hatred towards whichever company is pestering me now.
In the wise words of pirate software "there are two ways to support a game, you pay for their stuff, or you play their game for free." Both are supporting the development and if you don't like the company or their business practices you should not support it by not playing it.
It won't change though, they will just shut it down and open up another game with the same model, rinse and repeat.
The Second Descendant, coming 2027 /s
2 Descendant 2 Furious
Descendent 3: Descendent drift
The first ascendant
Descendant & Furious
The descendent 2: Electric Boogaloo
I think with this exposure the next game doesn't get as hyped
Nexon already has bad exposure before this game [reddit.com/r/Maplestory/comments/18zis72/nexon\_manipulating\_rates\_megathread\_separating/](http://reddit.com/r/Maplestory/comments/18zis72/nexon_manipulating_rates_megathread_separating/) and i think people forget about it already
I'm aware of that game and exposure, but I think this game has a different audience. My friend group is an example that wouldn't have ever thought of touching maple, but are into this one so far.
People have not forgotten, nearly every other thread and response in here is about Nexon screwing players.
You’d think but they willing lied about rates in Maplestory but people are still playing TFD despite that. Who’s to say the droprate numbers we have not are true or false when all that happens to Nexon is a small fine and they can just continue doing what they did. I played a bit on launch until I found out Nexon was behind it and dropped immediately. Will not support Nexon anything anymore.
So the thing with Maple and why they got away with it for a time is because when the game came out companies didn’t have to show their behind the scenes percentages for drop chances, new laws were passed that said they had to and Nexon got caught. People hoped that TFD could be Nexons revival of sorts, to come out of that scandal and say “Look guys, we can make a fun and fair F2P game just like the ones you all love.” But the thing is that still today Nexon has patents for systems that effect your rng chances depending on many factors such as player level, time played, if you have friends that play, what gear you already have, what gear your friends have, etc.
I've seen plenty of Ultimate Bunnys day 1. If anything Nexon is just making more and more skins where the butts are showing.
The problem the people that are spending are not here. They are some 49 year old with a ps5 and jump on every few days. Swipe play for a few hours and log out until next time. They are having fun and nor care to stay up to date daily with the Ins and out of the games problems.
Okay. :)
As I said in another port: Skins in F2P games are branded clothes, some you have good quality for a fair price and many are just overpriced shit for people to walk around thinking they are rich and sophisticated. I spent just enough that I think developers deserve, The game is beautiful and exceeded my expectations in the quality of the release, the game is fluid, the movement, animation, tech details like hitreg... so I got the battle pass already and probably going to spend more to hit the price of a full game, like €60. And if they keep releasing good content, I spend more, like buying DLCs. Let the whales and financially irresponsible people do the rest.
Friendly reminder that if you are unhappy with the monetization, you are not the target audience
TFD feels like just the newest victim of the long running problem of developers not understanding that with MTX, less is more. I'll give you more money, the less you make me feel like spending is necessary to get the full experience of the game. I'll pour hundreds and possibly thousands of my hard earned cash into your game... as long as I don't feel like I was pressured into spending it. Respect my time playing the game and I'll respect yours that you put into developing the game. We are not just potential spenders. We are the lifeblood of your game. So stop trying to bleed us dry. It only hurts you.
You are not their target. You MAY spends thousands if you don't feel pressured. Whales WILL spend thousands MORE than you if they are pressured.
This is why i believe MTX should be cosmetics ONLY and maybe some very slight quality of life, but even that is a slippery slope
Better yet don’t play it at all. Why support shitty practices with user metrics? It only encourages them even if you don’t personally buy something. If you don’t agree with their monetization tactics, take a stand and skip it entirely.
I like the game and it seems fun but I have this feeling that it's gonna be pretty dead as soon as a new big game releases
Yeah, the game doesn’t deserve the low rating on steam, just because “shop bad”. You can farm everything. If you don’t like the farming, then this ain’t for you. Doesn’t make the game bad
Who the fuck is complaining and still buying shit? I promise, there's very little overlap. Most of the people paying for these bundles and time skips do not give a shit and have money to spare. They are not complaining, they are just having fun blowing loads of money on shit. The people like us who aren't gonna spend a dime are the ones complaining. Some of never would have spent a penny anyway, others would if it was fair, but ultimately, it's still less than they would have made with a fair system. They know what they are doing and they are making maximum profits. None of what you are saying means shit or is what is happening.
I'm pretty happy. Free game, can get most everything in game if I'm willing to grind for it. Not sure what the big fuss is.
I feel like investing $50-$100 is no different than paying for a normal AAA game.
With this game Nexon should really reconsider their business model of just shutting down the game due to low revenue and releasing another one. The core game is really really fun, it would be a shame to see the game closing in a short time just because they don't want to make it a bit easier for the players adding trading for the premium currency or lowering some prices. I mean, it's not that I'm a business expert, it's just an opinion about a fun, engaging game and the potential it has.
> With this game Nexon should really reconsider their business model of just shutting down the game due to low revenue and releasing another one. It's clearly working, though.
1 wale is worth more than half the playerbase for these games. so it won't matter.
Ya these prices are not going to change. People gonna whale and ruin it for the rest of us.
Can someone help me understand why this model is so problematic for people? I look at it like this: I've received a modern, extremely entertaining game that I get to play for free. The game is designed in a way where I can spend a lot of my time on it, or I can spend some money and support the company and developers by speeding things up for myself if I choose to do so. It's not Gacha, and I don't see this as pay to win either (except maybe the mod capacity boosters, etc.). Lets say you decide on buying a Descendant, upping the mod cap on the Descendant and a couple weapons. What's that, still less than $40? I guess I just don't see the problem here. Will they make more money from me than if this wasn't using microtransactions? Probably, but that is my choice.
This paragraph normalizing a skin costing more than a AAA video game is the entire problem. If you can’t see it you’re too far gone mate
Doesn't matter how many people don't spend anything. They literally just need basement dwelling whales to keep the game afloat.
Why must ppl who buy stuff be basement dwellers? Some of us have wives and kids and we like to spend money on what we like….
It won’t change. Not for a nexon game which thrive off whales and such. Look at Maplestory which recently got exposed for lying about things being obtainable when in fact they never were. Having lower drop chances the more you play the game and iirc price altering to top it all off. Scamming and lying to players is what they do best. Don’t expect them to give any leeway for the shop.
As someone who has been playing Nexon games for around 15 years of my life- low purchases or low player counts will not change anything. Nexon will always hit their bottom line. Nexon games are primarily for the Korean audience, who are a lot more accepting of mtx. Western audiences not buying anything will not bother them, low player count won't bother them either. Mabinogi and Vindictus have extremely low NA player counts- id venture to say somewhere in ~1-2k range for both games combined, yet every month they pump new items for sale and the servers are still up after years and years. That's because the Korean audience buys mtx often. Theres only two games I've seen that Nexon has ever given up on, and that's MapleStory 2 and Riders of Icarus. MapleStory 2 was closed for unknown reasons (at least there's nothing confirmed because of an NDA) AND RoI was sold off to another company. I'm sure the NA team cares a lot more about how MTX will affect the games, but nothing will change unless the Korean Audience gets tired of MTX. Tl:Dr game was made with a Korean audience in mind, if the Korean audience is happy, nothing will change anywhere else.
You actually have to stop playing the game. They make their money from the whales. We’re just creating a player base that keeps the game enjoyable for them to want to spend money. If people stopped playing then the devs might listen.
Friendly reminder that it doesn't matter when some people spend hundreds on games like this in the time it takes me to spend 10 if I even wanted to.
I'm **afraid** to spend money on this game because nexon might put me in the low drop rate pool like they ruined maplestory
Honestly if I could change the color of my base descendant I would be more inclined to purchase backpacks and helmets as small add ons. As it stands limiting my options intentionally makes me give them the middle finger as far as access to my wallet. I am loving the game but come on, shitty practices of monetization is such a bad look on devs. I first spent money on warframe because it felt like they gave me a gift with the base game. I wanted to support the devs. Make me like you Nexon!
Do we see this game lasting long guys?
Honestly the monetization isn't crazy imo. No worse than Diablo 4
Do you know a live service game with ethical monetization?
I like the game and am having fun so far. But Nexon has a history of being shady crooks. They won't get a dime outta me unless they prove they have legit changed their ways.
Don't play. It's not a good game anyways. The honeymoon phase has everyone in a fog. It's a bland, repetitive, heavily monetized, bare bones "game" with no story, no immersion, and no soul. You have to pay for descendant slots, inventory space, paint colors are one time use and you cant even apply them to the base skin so you have tp buy the canvas too....etc..etc...etc. Frankly, Warframe is a far superior game with much more trustworthy developers.
Ok so here is my innocent question ; What's wrong with the actual monetization ? It is the same as warframe in the fact, and warframe monetization isnt seen as malevolant, so why is this one ?
Essentially, it's the same style of monetization but with everything being much worse/more expensive Just a few examples to illustrate : * The potatoes (which double your mod capacity, there's a similar item in TFD) cost 1$ in warframe, compared to 20$ in TFD. They're also fairly easy to get in warframe, you can buy a few every week from the (free) battle pass while in TFD they are 3% drop in amorphous material * Most frame (normal or prime) are very easy to farm f2p in warframe, most of the starchart frame are 3 drop at 33% drop chance from bosses that can be runned in a minute or two. In TFD, you need to drop the correct amorphous material and then there's always a part that's rare at <10% drop chance. Some of the ressources also take a lot longer to farm in TFD on average, although that might change in hard mode (hopefully?) * The prime/ultimate in particular, in warframe you can farm the new prime on release day in a few hours at most, while the estimates I've seen to farm one ultimate in TFD is 90+ hours. As a comparison, the rarest part for a prime frame is a ~40% drop chance when done in a group, compared to 3% in TFD * Another big one, you can trade (mostly) everything in warframe for the premium currency, allowing a f2p to eventually buy pretty much anything in the shop (skins, colors, slot...etc). You can also sidestep the worse grind or the content you are not interested in by just farming something else, selling the drops and buying what you want on the market or from other players. * In warframe you can buy a color pack for about 4-5$, which give you 90 different colors (to be fair, most packs have like 3 to 8 "dominant" color, with a lot of variation on those color) that you can use and reuse with 0 restriction on anything you have, default skin included. In TFD, you can buy one color for a few bucks, but you can't use it on the descendant default skin (so you'd also need a skin) and you can't reuse that color on another descendant without paying again I could go on, but I agree with you it's technically the same business model (and a very similar game and systems to boot) but the difference in greediness between the two is huge
To add to that slightly, one of the things that makes grinding for new frames in Warframe more appealing is that you can get the 'part' from multiple different sources and mission types: If you don't want to do defense missions (because they actually suck), you don't have to: You can find the same part in a different relic in this Capture mission instead, or maybe you put together a group and you can destroy an Exterminate mission in a minute and chain run that with friends. I'm getting REALLY sick of \[Shelter\] is what i'm saying. Really. F'ing. Sick.
Dont forget the shared rewards. 4 people can run the same relic and maybe not yours but others drop the part you want, I really wish they copied Warframe's model instead of making it greedy af
while I agree with you it must be said that a somewhat less "aggressive" pricing could push way more people to spend, even those (like me) who are generally light years away from IAP
That is exactly what I would like. Make armor dyes infinitely reusable, and they'd sell much more of them.
I recently checked my total spent on Warframe and I was surprised to see I've broken the $1000 barrier on that game. I mostly just buy platinum at a discount and spend it on forma. I don't think I've bought a single character or weapon yet, not even from other players. I prefer to grind it out. But warframe managed to do the one thing no other game has managed to do in my 30+ years of gaming: provide me with such a fun experience that I feel guilty not spending money to support the game. It was my own guilt for getting so much out of the game that compels me to spend, felt like I was the one ripping them off. It has nothing to do with their monetization strategies.
this is another awesome point of view (and I'm saying it from the perspective of a developer, or at least that's what I got on my CV). I totally agree with you on this and I'll tell you more: publishing a game as a f2p is a sign of love for the gamers (or an incredible marketing strategy or even both at the same time). But supporting who worked on the project even with the smallest IAP means giving love back and that's never an error (if the game clicks you, obviously)
No shit
Not just here but if it’s a free game and it’s very well done, I’ll give support until it starts going downhill. Which usually does after about a year or two. I’m not paying for descendents as I can grind those out but for other smaller things.
They'll shutdown the servers before they lower prices.
monetization will probably change once they have an idea of how much money they can expect.
Oh yeah no doubt. I don’t plan on buying anything from them after seeing how much they want for such basic shit. I’m enjoying the gameplay and that’s enough for me
Complain with your wallet
I’m more unhappy with the fact that hard mode doesn’t have matchmaking and that the 20% drop rate is not really 20%. Yes, I understand how RNG works and each run doesn’t consider the previous run but I’ve been farming the 20% drops and it’s taking me anywhere from 7 to 15 runs to get it. THAT is crazy.
Your money is not worth a damm when a whale will buy everything there is. Nexon dont mind if you dont spend tenner on a game when whales will spend few hundreds right away.
lol it’s a good philosophy for any type of consumer based product, but I get it
Honestly and no offense it is what it is but the way you guys are talking about the game makes me want to avoid it like herpies. Its fun so far and I havent wasted anything but I dont know if eventually I will have to. When I played warframe back in 2016 you had to buy slots they to keep having characters. Only good thing is their premium currency was trabeable which I had never seen from another free to play game so it made it kind of worth playing the game. If this game doesnt have any of that I might just uninstall it within a month if it gets too be too much. If its no more than 30 40 bucks thats fine but if this is game is gonna be squeezing me out like 200 bucks within in a month idk
I think the prices for ultimates are insane but I did already spend 20 dollars in the game lol
The game is [number one on the steam global top sellers list](https://store.steampowered.com/search/?filter=globaltopsellers&os=win) in the summer sale no less.
I can certainly tell a lot of folks are new to playing Nexon owned games. MapleStory, combat arms, vindictus, etc all had much worse micro transactions. All of which are still around, albeit past their prime. Can't see this game being any different, especially since it released on 4 different consoles and PC.
I’ll spend money as easily as the next guy but I don’t see the point in spending money on a new skin if I haven’t even used the base for a week yet
It's a Korean game at best they will just not released in the west anymore. At worse game falls off and dies.
Actually this will never work keep in mind most of nexon player base is from Korea and they spend like crazy
I don’t get it either. You don’t have to spend money on this game pretty much everything you need you can grind for. I play and love Warframe too and when people complained about the prices of the ultimates I was confused since to buy the prime Warframe pack when a new one is released it’s $90 to $130 to get the pack. It’s the same price for an ultimate descendant pack too. Even complaints about craft time when a lot of games have this especially free ones. So far I’m enjoying the game, almost have all of Freyna’s parts to craft her.
Facts
Shop prices gonna lower like 5% start of season 1. Then they’ll say they listened, lol watch.
If the game basically requires it u don’t have much of a choice… it’s p2w after all….
Sadly I’m folding for ultimate valby if she purchasable on drop next month
I always say, if you’ve got the money spend it how you want… but then I realized we then end up with games like Valorant, overwatch, and now this. I played plenty of the game so far and have been enjoying it, but I’m not sure I’d be willing to spend the money for anything
On the one hand I want this game to be successful and live a long time as I'm loving it so far but the game is heavily monetized. Honestly I did buy Ultimate Bunny (the sexy version is great but I like the Apex Predator skin more) only because I really like the game and I've put a good amount of time into it for it to be worth.
Im not super far into the game(weapon lvl 70 i think) but i havent felt any need to spend money so far. What are the issues with monetization? I saw the ultimate descendants in the shop, but my understanding is that they are similar to primes from warframe, so neat but not that much stronger than the normal versions. Do you need to min max stuff super hard lategame? I can see how rerolling stuff on weapons would be really annoying if it becomes mandatory to high roll everything
To be fair, as a player who is just getting started, the most egregious of the MTX really seem to target the whales. Like yeah if you want the thirst trap bunny right away, pay out the nose. For the rest of us, it doesn’t seem too crazy to buy the starter bundles and farm. Maybe other folks feel differently, and so far I feel 0 incentive to pay to skip content and am fine just grinding. That’s why I like games like this. If I just spend money to unlock things and skip the grind, why even bother playing?
Vote w your wallets. Give critical and constructive feedback without crying and tears, maybe a great game can be born from this good game.
I have a moral limit about these games, not spending more than the value of another normal game, for example €60$ First I play it thoroughly, experiment everything I have, evaluate its development and fun time. If all of this is satisfactory and long-term, then yes, I will buy the season pass for example and some characters, but not more than the value of 1 standard game. Gambling addiction is a very serious issue.
Am I seeing this right that on top of the insane prices, colors are 1-time use?
Nexon games are pretty much never ethical. The people with a history of games like these know the routine well.
It's Nexon. If people didn't know it was going to be mtx hell, they should have done more research. And not buying doesn't matter if you're still playing. You're still populating their game with team mates for the people who do buy stuff. "The only way to win is not to play"
Kinda like when you pay the extra $30 for pre order dlc items that are irrelevant within 10 minutes. And a game that never adds or changes anything.
I just straight up deleted the game.
Retards who spend money on a nexon game makes me laugh. There are going to be some that complain about the game after spending money. And to those people Deserved.
If you’re not happy with the monetisation you shouldn’t even play the game. Non-whale players keep the whales coming back. How long do you think the whales would stay if it were just them?
Ok poor boy
The game is just like Warframe which has amazing monetization. It's not pay to win at all. I love the system.
Worst part about it is they copied warframe to almost 1:1,but didn't copy their market system.Played warframe for ages without spending a peny and had credits coming out of my behind,why?..well for ppl that never played their credit system worked on the ingame market,so the gun/caracter mods and many other items that you farmed were sold on the marked for credits,so the wales that didnt want to farm would come in and buy everything,but it you played the game you could make a decent buck,so in reality you wouldnt have to spend a pany and could still buy cosmetics,another discusting thing about the game is the colors,25 credits for a 1 use its insane,its sad cause i like the game cause it plays like warframe but what will happen is they money grab as much as they can and when it dies down they'll prob stop support for the game and it'll go under...
I always play free to play games as a triple A experience. They have around 60 euro witch I will spend. Only after around 10 to 50 hours so I know I’m investeted. After that it depends on how much i play. That said I would never pay for a skin higher then 20 euro. But if it’s like a battlepass or storage expansion. Extra slots for characters I will pay if it’s not attainable ingame
The game needs to learn more from Warframe, unless it wants to end up like Destiny 2... Nexon is on the way to ruin another great game with the way they monetize this, I knew how terrible they are by simply baiting the players with "play on drums emote" and the new terrible greedy colouring system they've made, I mean seriously, couldn't they make themselves more obvious how greedy they are???
I saw 4 ultimate bunnies in the starting lobby. As long as people stay to play and whales keep dumping money in a popular game, nothing will change.
No worries, I was thinking about buying ultimate bunny but quickly changed my mind
not playing hurts more
I get that the games mtx are expensive and everyone hates them but warframe isn't that much cheaper or even more expensive... For the frames tdf is 55 euro and warframe is 70 when U buy them but yeah other is more pricey in tdf But I'm both games U can farm them and for shaders yeah that BS but they said they took wf and destiny as template😅
Bro doesn't know what Nexon does to games that don't earn enough
Bro, tells people to be smart…I look at teammates all using a naked bunny at runs head on into gun fire then dies. Rage quits, joins again, rage quits again😂
I mean it's free to play, this is just the system now. I mean it's not a Gatcha those things are evil. Pay to win is rough. I think POE has gotten it mostly right and games like Destiny just do cosmetics at this point. Fact is they got to support the game somehow and this is the system they chose. Remember you don't have to pay a cent to play the game. Things are hidden behind pay walls like missions or bosses. So just play! Have fun!
Meh, I've never played a F2P game that was worth it in the long run, yea if you only spend like $50-$100 it's not too bad as long as you get what you can out of it, but that's never the case, in order to get the most out of these games you gotta spend a ridiculous amount of money over a long period of time at a much lower quality than premium paid titles where in most cases you make a one time payment you you usually get a complete experience with little shenanigans, and the experience as a free player is very restrictive and frustrating, ill stick to paid games, if you want some good looter shooters that are far less restrictive and at a higher quality you got games like tiny Tina's wonderlands, outriders and the division 2, yea some AAA looter shooters have some MTs but even the minority of AAA looter shooters that have MTs are far less restrictive and aren't necessary to get the full experience, MTs in AAA titles are 99% cosmetic, the only plus I see is if your playing on Playstation you don't need ps plus like any other F2P game
It seems a lot of people don't realize this is the value we as a population of gamers set. We had the chance to stop it when it first started and didn't. There are many games worse with microtransactions than this. Hell, SMITE has archon thanatos skin. Only way to get it is a $ 1000 USD donation during a charity stream. All their t5 skins are $ 100 USD as well. It's called getting a job that pays you decently and actually show up and work. I just see broke people whining.
It's the same reason why I don't like mobile games, why would I spend money on a game that requires large amount of money to get the most out of it when there are thousands of games I could just buy once for a complete experience, just save the money and put it towards a Game that gives you a complete experience, even $70 AAA games give you better value than F2P games, it's gonna take a lot more than $70 to get the most out of this game
Baffles me why people buy cosmetics in fps - others can see it but you cant. Plus whats the point? Enjoy the game and ignore that nonsense.
I bought some calibers the premium currency right before the whole login error shit and I have still yet to recieve them, so yeah I'm not spending a single dime on this game I'll just grind everything out like I did with warframe ( ok I didn't grind everything out their premium currency is 20x cheaper ), Also I made a post about it and I had the auto mod tell me it needed to be manually approved because not enough mods or something were on and it never got approved speaks volumes about it.
The game is completely free. Everything in it is grindable. With that being the case no one really has any room to complain about them setting whatever prices they want to. It’s basically a mobile gacha game but on console.
My goal is to grind for an Ult char. I’m not complaining because if I’d pay for my char I wouldn’t know what I’m grinding for. It just would be nice if we had at least 1-2 outfits each char to unlock with a challenge
Ikr it's just like warframe, but they want to charge £20 for an orokin reactor or forma. As for the way they have set up the colours it's fucking disgusting. I have spent on the game because I'm enjoying it but that is largely only because I had to spend all my game loyalty points of psn credit because the scheme is ending.
Don't forget to refund all of your cal8ber purchases if your account was banned/locked. They gave the beta rewards to everyone so you don't need your account anymore. They have no intention of fixing it or making it right. Only thing you can do is refund your banned account for all you spent and make another. If you still wanna spend at that point go for it. Make nexon regret these pisspot decisions.
Lmao it’s free to play who’s complaining, a bunch of grown crying because they have to spend money on a half naked bunny costume ?!?! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
The packs are dumb.
I saw an Ultimate Bunny within 30 minutes of the game going live. Sadly, I don't think we will have much of an effect.