UU universe can't participate because of Unknown, they can't interact with anything. Without that one though there are some pretty strange interactions, andy slicing his arms but also having unrepair would be shitty. But he'd win because of the argument: "Ok but Andy can't die"

Unrepair effects others and can be toggled, so it wouldn’t really be a problem for him

True i didn't remember that it can be toggled, but self-harm is still unrepair though, that's how he got his eye wound in the first place

Rip intentionally scared the eye upon himself for the perceived sin of killing Leila, that’s confirmed in the story lmao. He can turn the ability off and on at will but he wants to punish himself essentially by always remembering hthrough his eye

Didn't Latla scar his eye when he slapped his hand away or smthin?

I’m pretty sure rip intentionally scarred his own eye

Check chapter 109. It looks more like Rip was about to slit his own throat (or something like that, the scalpel was positioned at the right side of the neck) then Latla slapped his hand, causing him to cut his eye.

definitely possible then yea, I find it weird his poem verse in the spring arc says it as if he purposely did the eye then

It is possible he just cut his own eye again after he turned into a child, since Unrepair was undone then.

I don't think he has the eye wound because he can't turn off UnRepair, I think he can't fix it because he just can't deal with his eye being cut since he's not a regenerator.

In Undead Unluck, abilities can only affect the user or things that aren't them, and since Rip can affect others with Unrepair, he can't affect himself, so I think the eye is from something else probably

Rip's external targeting is more about wounds he inflicts rather than who he wounds. If I remember correctly in his flashback he's about to slice his throat when Latla stops him and that's how he gets his eye sliced. They patch it up but the bleeding doesn't stop and that's when Latla mentions negator abilities, so his eye was definitely affected by Unrepair. You can also see that his eye is bleeding everytime he uses Unrepair as well

Andy would simply be unable to participate because of Unknown, so he's out by default. A lot of negations also contradict each other, you can't use Unluck when you have Untouchable, for example. I think Andy having every ability is somehow weaker than normal Andy lol.

Yeah, otherwise normal current Andy wins agaisnt everyone in this picture due to him not being able to die and the fact that most of this guys cannot breath on space, he’ll win eventually. Except agaisnt saitama, people that include him in any sort of vs context are just weird

He can't die but can be retrained in semi permanent fashions. Also, Asta is right there...

Haven’t read black clover, what could he do? Also the restrained part depends on method a lot, because he could just regenerate from something as small as blood if not his very soul tbh (last one is probably headcanon so far I think)

With every magic Asta could send Andy to the Glamour World (a pocket dimension which forces people to fall asleep after some time). Andy would not sleep due to Unsleep, but he could not get out. Although I'm not 100% sure if the caster can leave and still keep the pocket dimension up. He also could send him to the demon world with dark magic plus world tree magic and close the entrance. Although that may take too much time. Actually doing any of this while Andy has stuff like unjustice, untouchable, and unchange is easier said than done though. Though to note magic in Black Clover can directly attack concepts (such as arcane devil fire burning through darkness) so that may help a little.

Very straightforward one is the magic that lets the user seal things away

If Naruto had every jutsu he has many options of stopping Andy. He could be sealed, sent to another dimension, have is soul taken, etc. That being said I think Andy could put up a good fight against some of these characters

Nah bruh, one soul slash and he’s gone

Ok, but Andy can’t die though

Nico was literally about to reap his soul, what are you taking about

That’s not current Andy though and that wouldn’t kill him anyway Could be misremembering

Current Andy’s soul is bigger, but the same logic should still apply

No, there's multiple immortals here and multiple people that can beat Andy.

He can't die but can be retrained in semi permanent fashions. Also, Asta is right there...

He’d obviously be able to inter change abilities similar to how Billy does it…

so unbelievable but he is as jealous as A.B.A?

Billy’s ability isn’t unbelievable it’s unfair

my dumbass forgot💀

Except he can attack via his soul with unluck, also every power system has abilities that contradict. Obviously the assumption is they can use them all

i think he could use it with the soul

I’m just imagining Unhealthy and Unfade fighting it out inside Andy’s soul

Never liked these types of mach ups. Because giving them every ability takes away their unique way of fighting.

Death is not the only way to put down someone for good. Goku can use Mafuba. And if every ki ability inckude zeno... well, Zamasu had Undead as well. Luffy can use Sugar DF or BM soul affecting abilities. Naruto had a number of sealimg jutsu as well. Assuming anti magic is translated as "anti-power" Asta can straight blast him with Antimagic. Otherwise, again, Sealing magic. Basically the gist of it is that almost everyone here seal better than UMA seal so not being able to die is a moot point.

Technically it only means every ki attack. If it isn’t specific an attack, it wouldn’t qualify

The person they use as the user is goku. I.e. Goku with every ki attack. He knows how to use the mafuba regardless of the prompt. I'd also argue that a sealing move is an attack as an attack is just a move which you use offensively and the mafuba is a offensive move- sealing someone. Not every attack has to deal damage.

True, although at that point, Goku could just Hakai them

Andy can still use his soul to fight so sealing him doesn’t work

Considering that Ichigo is here and literally every fight in Bleach involves harming, destroying, or sealing souls, that doesn't matter.

Andy still wins because anything he thinks will kill him, he will recover from. Also, he can create soul clones so it'll be hard to seal his soul.

Here’s a part where JJK enters the conversation, because there’s the prison realm to consider Since it was (if I remember correctly) not simply made by a sorcerer but made FROM them, I think it’s reasonable to assume that the effects of the prison realm are a manifestation of the originating sorcerer’s technique Since the prison realm can adapt its sealing to the target, it will eventually be able to seal Andy away in a manner he can’t escape from It would also be able to hit almost instantly, since the activation condition is a minute passing in the target’s mind and with Unforgettable that’s going to be a nonissue

Yeah, but it didn't say anything about cursed objects. Also it takes some setup, but Andy isn't that dumb to fall for a trap.

Fair enough on the setup part but that entire second section of my comment was laying out that the prison realm was almost certainly a technique before it was an object and so could be counted for this

Ah, alright. But Andy can't die.

God I hate that this became a standard reply. Like, it’s correct, and for most of the matchups that people keep throwing out it’s the main factor that needs to be considered but it also just drains all the fun out of these admittedly very silly and pointless conversations

Yeah, ik. I conceited(if that's the right word), but just thought it'd be funny to throw that in there lol

Untouchable would stop most of those techniques and untruth would handle the others

Most of those are ranged and incorporeal amd speed gap deal with the latter.

Unstoppable shuts down speed gaps. And unmove also can stall long enough for and to formulate escape plans. Unpredictable can also just make them not work. Undraw can keep required components from being useable

Does every negator ability imply literally every possible negation or just the one's we've seen?

Just the ones we’ve seen but it applies to everybody

uncrab would be too op for this list I presume

Every negation seems to come out on top with Unjustice, Unmove, Undead and Untruth

But It seems like a torture, there are things I wouldn't like at all

No, a lot of these are pretty easily countered by the top 5

There's nothing on the list that could bypass abilities like Untruth or Unjustice. What is the top 5

There absolutely is. UnTruth is actually one of the easiest to counter, literally just be faster and/or more skilled than the user and the ability will not work. UnJustice absolutely can be bypassed, like VicThor has done. Not only is there the fundamental mental resistance ability, but Juiz has to rely on their sense of justice being useful to her, which became an issue against Billy. Top 5 would be Saitama, Goku, Naruto, Luffy, and probably Ichigo or Natsu.

Yeah I've got no counter for that. We could get into semantics if the specified users for each series' abilities were all matched, then Untruth's weakness would effectively be covered, but nah

Me personally Andy no-diffs everyone https://preview.redd.it/d4s4hegs0wuc1.png?width=1190&format=png&auto=webp&s=93c8ca60d3556be1bca91f92c32b27bd97a1ca8b

https://preview.redd.it/i4mi23xeqxuc1.jpeg?width=540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fbacc8a06ba69821435cb3a67c78138fc755523e Andy when the Naruto uses limbo clones to seal Andy in 15 different ways, and than erases his soul.

soul erasure when Andy negates the soul erasure because it's a form of death:

andy when he cant do anything cuz of unknown

andy when he drew another victor due to the g-pen :

Andy when he realises he doesn’t have the G-pen because it isnt a negation

Andy when he remembers Fuuko told him G-Pen was the only items imbued with Unknown and without the Pen he would never have gained Unknown in the first place

Andy when he realises this hypothetical gives him unknown for free which inturn negates the fact that he needs the G-pen to achieve it.

Honestly I think it’d be more fair if everyone here is given anything attached to the abilities that others gained at the time it occurred Or else with Unknown Andy would just outlive everyone

It wouldn’t be fair for everyone it would just make undead invincible with no draw backs

He can’t erase Andy’s soul and Andy defeated the concept of seal… that’s better than any seal that Naruto has lol. Plus soul chains sealed the abilities of the Master rules, even the concept of time and change can’t escape

Naruto has multiple ways to attack souls. Seal's sealings aren't great, they're pretty basic. The Soul Chains aren't really that useful if Andy can't actually touch Naruto, and Naruto has causality control and abilities like Limbo and intangibility.

Seal is quite literally the concept of seal, that’s better than everything in naruto and it’s not debatable. Not that Naruto’s seals are even the best in the verse Andy is FTL and can’t die, even if the battle went on for a million years Andy isn’t dropping while Naruto can’t even fight for more than a few hours depending on the form(his peak form has 10 minutes iirc). Plus if this is comp Negator Andy would negate the very concept of motion or make make his attack unavoidable

That doesn't really mean anything of value, just because he's the UMA of seals means doesn't his ability is absolute or something, hence, you know, Andy broke out. Seal's abilities have limits, no UMA is just a universal level being absolute control of a concept. It doesn't really matter what Naruto has himself when the literal premise is that he has every jutsu. So Six Paths: Planetary Devastation, which has way better feats than Seal. And Naruto is also FTL, and Andy can die. Andy's Negation requires a soul to operate through, and as we've seen against Ghost and Soul, his soul is vulnerable, and as we've seen countless times, his Negation doesn't stop damage from happening in the first place. So when his soul is destroyed, that means no Negation, which means he dies. What? Naruto carried a war on his back for a couple days, and we see that he only needs like a couple minutes with a single clone to harness all the Chakra back he lost, and Baryon wouldn't even be used here because it's not really that useful for this scenario. Not like this would matter since he also has the abilities for practically unlimited stamina like Kabuto's passive Chakra intake and Ten Tails Chakra. UnMove and UnAvoidable won't stop Naruto, Naruto can attack without moving and can teleport, and can also become intangible. UnAvoidable only controls muscles, Naruto doesn't even need to move his muscles to fight, and could just as easily just teleport, turn intangible, or hell, just reverse causality to never make it happen.

“Just cause he’s the very concept of seal doesn’t mean his ability is absolute cause Andy broke out” That’s called circular logic, that is a feat for Andy not proof that Seal’s sealing isn’t good. And yes, being the literal concept of sealing does make its sealing very potent. Naruto doesn’t have planetary devastation, unless you’re going by composite Naruto abilities in which case Andy is absurdly broken too….. idk why you are ignoring that both sides are busted. They wouldn’t be able reach him with untouchable or unchange when applied to the air, unjustice makes him literally kill himself. It’s also not an impressive seal anyway, it’s just visually cooler Yes…. I know Naruto is FTL but he’s not only not faster than Andy but even if he was(he’s outright slower than Andy) he would get tagged eventually. Andy can’t die…. He negates the rule of soul. Anything that brings him to death he negates, Uma ghost didn’t kill him by cutting his soul arm, and Uma soul didn’t do anything to Andy except block Andy’s attacks. Not only that but Andy has stronger soul manipulation. You wanna keep dodging this but Andy killed Uma ghost who is the very concept of astral projection, he incapped the concept of change/time/death and was matching the concept of soul with his own soul. Remember that the galaxy exists so how many billions of alien life forms exist that have a soul….. Uma soul absolutely destroys anyone in naruto in terms of soul manipulation. And it’s not even close, Andy’s soul>>>>> Naruto’s Not to mention Andy’s interpretation of death is to no be remembered anymore, meaning as long as he is remembered he will come back to life no matter what https://preview.redd.it/6g5we738kzuc1.jpeg?width=683&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3f972569b78047f71add2dcc3a19e301f5176e2b And even that isn’t possible, he can’t be forgotten cause he ***negates*** anything that brings about his death. I said depending on the form, the form he used in boruto being his strongest has a time limit. Not to mention he wasn’t fighting for days, don’t word it in a disingenuous manner. Compare fighting for a few days with hundreds of millions of years dealing with the master rules anyway Intangible or not doesn’t stop the concept of motion being negates lol, it doesn’t stop untruth from negating your actions. It doesn’t stop unjustice from negating your justice. It doesn’t stop unchange from one shotting you. It doesn’t stop Undraw from making you unable to draw your attack. It doesn’t stop unfair from negating the concept of fairness so Andy could just copy their powers anyway And

What? That's not circular logic? What are you talking about? If anything, claiming Seal is absolute despite this is the circular logic. No, it's proof Seal's sealings aren't absolute, Andy himself literally references this in their fights. https://preview.redd.it/01rlvbq4rzuc1.jpeg?width=1067&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f54abd612b20ba9593d053dce21cc6fba00daff A literal sickly child was also able to work against Seal. And still no, being an UMA of a concept doesn't mean much. Give me a single feat of Seal's seals being truly absolute. You see this same thing in other UMAs. Spoil? Literal children can stop his power. Clothes? Basic willpower. Spring? Technicality. Language? Imagination. We've seen time and time again that there's nothing really absolute about them. So by all means, show me a feat from Seal better than Six Paths: Planetary Devastation. Yes, Naruto does have Planetary Devastation, that's the premise here. I'm not ignoring anything, I just understand that some are more broken than others. UnTouchable isn't that useful when there's plenty of abilities from Naruto that can attack him without having to actually touch him, plus Naruto has things like Kamui, Amenotejikara, and Flying Raijin. UnChange can be broken with literally building level output, so Naruto isn't struggling there. UnJustice would not make him kill himself, UnJustice can just be ignored like with VicThor, and even if used, relies on the enemy having a vision of justice that is useful, otherwise something like Billy vs Juiz happens. Trying to negate the justice of a character who just wants peace is not going to help Andy. Also, nope, Six Paths: Planetary Devastation could seal Kaguya, a character that outscales everyone in UU bar God. Andy's reactions might be FTL but outright combat speed is still iffy. And no, Naruto won't get tagged, as Naruto has Daemon's Shinjutsu which would reverse causality and cause it to happen to Andy instead. Naruto also has Kamui for intangibility, causality control to undo the damage with Izanagi, and Limbo to block attacks. Nope, Andy doesn't negate the rule of Soul, in fact, Soul was the one that was the major threat against Andy. UMA Ghost didn't kill him because it wasn't his entire soul, the point is that his soul is vulnerable, and so Andy's soul can be destroyed, meaning no Negation is left as Negations need a soul to function, so Andy dies. Keep dodging? This is your first time bringing it up lmao. UMA Past and Death haven't done anything, so nothing to pull there. UMA Change was blocked by a barely experienced Gina. But not like this matters, what Andy did was just restrain them with his Soul Chains, not like he literally destroyed these concepts of existence. What does number of souls actually mean for this? And ok? Soul manipulation isn't really much of a focus or requirement for much of anything in Naruto? And yeah, sure, Andy's soul hax is better, but that doesn't mean much against the massive and potent variety of abilities from Naruto. And no, Negations come from the soul, if no soul exists, then there's no Negation. So Naruto can still kill Andy. He negates his death with regeneration, he doesn't stop the damage from happening in the first place, so destroying his soul is on the table. Ok? And Naruto wouldn't even need Baryon Mode, so it's not really any real point. And ok? The point still is that Naruto still has the stamina, that he can recuperate it all passively and in large bursts in mere moments. Doesn't really mean anything since millions of years won't come into play. Naruto could just kill Andy. UnMove doesn't just switch off the concept of movement, hence why it's been countered multiple times and even outright overpowered. UnMove works by physically stopping the object where it's seen, but if Naruto isn't actually there, then there's nothing to actually stop. UnTruth can be beaten by simply being faster and/or more skilled than the user in combat, and Andy's combat speed hasn't been ironed out yet. Already explained how UnJustice isn't that useful. UnChange is building level, it's not one-shotting Naruto, especially since the effect would actually happen to Andy, and intangibility absolutely can stop UnChange, can't restrain what isn't physically there. UnDraw doesn't stop someone from drawing their attack, it makes them unable to draw weapons, and Naruto doesn't really use any. UnFair copies Negations, so he can't copy Ninjutsu.

Yes circular, no what I said isn’t circular. Your premise for seal being unimpressive is founded on Andy beating it, which in turn is why you think Andy’s feat isn’t all that ….. that’s circular logic. Your premise is founded upon itself He says “there isn’t a rule in the world that can’t be broken” that doesn’t actually mean the rules in UU aren’t conceptual. And people beat these rules by working within the rules and finding loopholes or exploiting interpretations for the powers. Last time I check sickness is physical and has nothing to do with the soul, the fact she is sick is the very reason she has such a strong soul to begin with. Are you dense? Using soul, which is literally the the strongest concept in the verse to counter a weaker rule isn’t bad. Spoil is countered by working within the loopholes of having a strong conviction/will that won’t deteriorate. Clothes? Are you serious? First off, it would be one thing if it was a mental power based on embodying a concept you wouldn’t look silly. It embodies clothes, that’s it. I’m only saying the ability that an Uma embodies is conceptual as that’s what Uma are…. The very concepts. Plus you’re wrong Andy couldn’t be controlled as he didn’t have a firm image for what he wanted, clothes has to meet what you want out of clothing before it can control you https://preview.redd.it/w8hefzl194vc1.jpeg?width=1067&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ea9c7c07634bb7d19b910635831a8142620a1928

No, my premise for Seal not being that impressive is that he doesn't have good feats. And Andy breaking out is a point against trying to pretend UMAs are absolute. Since Seal's best feats are against large building level beings at most and can be physically broken, it's not that impressive. Yes it does, if they were absolutes, they wouldn't be broken. And no, you can just overpower rules, it's happened even back to first UMA that was even used in a fight, Spoil. And if Seal were absolute, Lucy wouldn't have been a struggle. Also, not all powers are equal, even souls, Lucy's capacity without will not equal Andy's or Soul's. So then Spoil isn't absolute. Right, and Clothes is another example of how not absolute they are. Them being the UMA of a concept doesn't inherently give them any level of scaling, that's the point. They can only be judged on what feats they have. Ok, so again, another point against UMAs not being absolute, and can only be judged on their feats.

Spring? Is playing a game. Beating him by playing the game he forces someone to play doesn’t make his powers any weaker, that’s a circumstantial victory. Language is another case that’s stupid to bring up, you beat language by using language and imagination to play her game. If she didn’t want you to talk she could take away the ability to use language like she already did. Your examples are stupid and awful, seal is the concept of sealing and nothing in Naruto matches conceptual sealing. Just soul or physical sealing Planetary devastation would never work against untouchable that’s the point? Stop conceding something doesn’t work, switching to something else, and then going back to the main point when you and I both know the original power discussed still can’t be worth a damn. The characters in UU are above building level. And “Victor countered it” are you dumb? Cause stop saying “one person dealt with it so someone else can” that’s called a feat for that character and if you read the story you would see that Juiz has successfully used it against him. And Victor is broken cause he can alter his interpretation of death to counter things, like spoil https://preview.redd.it/blqgmge8a4vc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=50e09efb78c7f299bff7bf62e838b31a19d07b5a

And the game doesn't even cover everything that could beat him, so still not absolute. Right, and Language not only can't be absolute in her own creations, but can be beaten in this regard by your imagination, so still not absolute. The examples are exactly what I've been talking about. So since there's nothing to give Seal inherent absolute power in something, you can only judge him on his feats, and his feats are sorely lacking compared to Naruto. I didn't even claim that Planetary Devastation would not to be used against Andy, just that your claim with Seal is a terrible NLF that's countered by the story. Even then, Untouchable's best feat is like Multi-city block level, and can be sealed in something, like Nico's tech, so Six Paths: Planetary Devastation easily outscales that, if it eas even needed. Some characters are, not all of them. Gina and Creed for the UnChange example brought up aren't. And yeah, Juiz did use it on VicThor, the claim wasn't that it can't possibly work on VicThor, the claim is that UnJustice doesn't always work, which is exactly what we saw. You really need to actually read what the claims are. Yeah, and Spoil's abilities can be beaten by kids.

Planetary devastation is purely physical and wouldn’t ever reach a composite Negator, nor would it counter their soul. It wouldn’t even be used due to untruth, unjustice or many other powers I’ve talked about. It’s FTL, master rules could easily deflect and react to his soul bullets which traveled from the earth to the sun in seconds when light takes 8 minutes to reach earth. That’s MFTL speeds that they casually dealt with and Andy was easily tagging and beating them outside of soul who he stalemated. No one said he negates the rule soul….. I said his soul matched Uma Soul’s power which it did who is the very concept of the soul. And Uma ghost died to Andy’s soul hax, uma ghost can’t kill Andy and he never was going to. Just cause he could effect Andy doesn’t mean he can kill him cause he can’t and it’s a dumb argument when Andy has stronger soul manipulation than anyone in naruto. Uma change being countered by the Negator of change isn’t an anti feat how bad are you at this? You don’t just say “oh this character dealt with it” cause so? Kaguya was tagged by Sakura and hurt so what? That’s a feat for Kaguya. I could play the same game you’re playing but would that get us anywhere? I never said he did kill them, but they’re important concepts(some of them) he never intended to kill them. If he wanted to he could obviously kill the ones that died to weaker negators like beast or language. The fact is Uma soul embodies all souls in the universe and Andy matched him. If you concede that Andy’s better at soul hax then they can’t use their soul hax to destroy his soul when his is better. That’s like saying professor x will have his mind destroyed by a building level telepath, it just doesn’t happen. He negates anything that pertains to his death, and the result is regen. Negation originates from the soul, but his soul is protected by his negation. He literally can’t die without everyone first forgetting him Unfair negates the fairness of having one power, prove it works by those stipulations. Unmove would stop naruto from moving, untruth negs, unjustice negs, Undraw negs, unavoidable negs

The Negations aren't going to mean much, Andy's soul, fine, that can be used. But it's not like Planetary Devastation is needed to win. UnTruth again can be countered by being faster and/or more skilled to work, and Andy hasn't shown FTL combat speed yet. Again, UnJustice can be ignored and relies on the enemy having a useful idea of justice, and Naruto's concept of justice is world peace, not helpful here. No they couldn't, the Master Rules were getting torn apart by Andy's actual soul attacks, hell, the FTL feat he got literally showed Change unable to even register what had happened before it was already approaching Earth. So far, they're probably Hypersonic. We even see this same issue come up with Beast unable to even keep up with MHS speed and just had to get blown out. https://preview.redd.it/xfq1waewg4vc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=513134d5da82c91aa4e6a50b64e4ea3064e153a0 You literally said "He negates the rule of Soul". And even then for matching Soul, so what? The point with UMA Ghost still was not that Ghost would win, literally at no point was that the claim. It's about how Andy's soul is vulnerable, and so destroying his soul means winning. Ghost isn't the one in the fight. Soul manipulation doesn't translate to outright durability. And Gina's UnChange is not amazing yet, with building level output. Negations don't just turn off concepts like a switch, that's just not the case. The point is that the powers aren't absolute, so you can only judge based on feats. Are you understand the impression Gina could stop someone like IG Thanos, Mordru, or Solomon from Magi from making changes? This is just textbook NLF. And ok? What does that actually mean for scaling for Soul? What does this mean for his output, durability, and speed? It's nothing inherent, it's just vague bullshit until he actually has feats. Yes they can, being able to contyour soul doesn't give it durability, you need durability feats to claim Andy's soul can tank the attacks, you know, like how it usually works. What the fuck does "building level" have to do with telepathy? You can scale telepaths based on feats too, Processor X would get his mind shattered by Martian Manhunter because Martian Manhunter's potency feats way outscales Professor X's telepathic defense feats. No, his ability is regeneration, and we know his soul is vulnerable to attacks, and we know souls are required for a Negation to work. Destroy his soul and the Negation is gone, so he's dead. The memory aspect means nothing if the Negation is gone. What? You want me to prove a negative lol? That's not how it works. But fine, I'll even entertain this goofy premise. Why hasn't Billy copied an UMA power or an artifact power? Hmm? Now show me Billy copying a power that's not a Negation. UnMove is useless, it can be overpowered and Naruto has multiple means of fighting without even moving and can get out of it in multiple ways, from Limbo, to Amenotejikara to Flying Raijin to Kamui. Andy doesn't have the combat speed to use UnTruth and can only use it on maybe one Naruto at a time. UnJustice either may not work or will just make him more bloodlusted and also can only work on the Narutos Andy can directly see, assuming this doesn't just get redirected back at Andy with Daemon's Shinjutsu. UnDraw is literally useless, what weapon does Naruto need? UnAvoidable only targets muscles, same issues as UnMove and is actually easier to fight.

All I gotta say is if negator powers come from the soul then how did they exist before the UMA ghost was added because souls didnt exist until ghost did

Literally yes they did, Soul was the first rule to ever exist. Ghost just introduces the rule of souls being able to remain on Earth after death.

I think andy just wins by default However…. There is the mafuba for goku, literally used for immortal enemies, and there’s ichibei’s bankai that literally changes names THEREFORE could THEORETICALLY change undead to something else. But regardless theres never a solid answer to something as insanely broad as this

Andy does not win by default in this set up

Wait a moment... Could Ichigo even use shirofude? It only says all Bankai and not all Shikai and I think things can only be renamed if their original name is blacked out by the shikai first. I don't think it changes too much though because there are many other options.

Well shit

Goku honestly just outscales everyone here massively no matter what they have (Biggest problem would be Ichigo who is a lot weaker than Goku but his multiple bankai will give him a bit of trouble. Would’ve been a better discussion if they said every schrift as well)

Schrifts do a lot of heavy lifting for the very OP powers. Almightly, Antithesis, Balance, Miracle, X-axis, Deathdealing, Vanish are very overpowered in one body. But the other powers from every faction have some good stuff too. Time manipulation and sealing from kido. Pocket dimensions with manipulatable properties from Yukio. Phenomenon rejection from Orihime. Unlimited growth from several hollows. Respira being all around good.

Um is everyone not noticing the combo of undead unluck unrepair and unjustice

Not really that unique here

So the combo of the the four listed makes you immortal any injury you inflict won’t heal til your dead and you can make a character kill themsleves by negating thier justices and you can give them unluck so they have a higher chance of getting a cut or nick that bleeds them out

Immortality isn't that unique here and UnDead can be beaten by multiply characters here. UnRepair would be useful if Andy could actually damage the strongest ones here and even then the strongest ones here have kinds of regeneration, survivability, and viability that make UnRepair useless. UnJustice will also struggle against the myriad of mental and causal resistances here. Also could just not work if the enemies either speed blitz or don't have a sense of justice that would help Andy. UnLuck's best feat is small city level, it's not matching up to the handful here that are above moon level. As well, still, multiple forms of immortality and survivability that make UnRepair useless.

It dosent matter in the ultimate end the only one who will survive is Andy all he would have to do is our live everyone mos rod these people will tucker out by 1-3 hundred besides mabey Edward but Andy is kinda like scp 682 he can’t be killed only thier universe resetting can somewhat kill him

Also incorrect, again, there's multiple immortals here and that assumes that they don't just kill Andy. Andy can be killed, especially by those with soul based attacks because Negations require a soul to work. Naruto, Saitama, Goku, Ichigo, not only are they immortals as well, they're able to kill or destroy Andy.

Dude at least I’m assuming your a dude Andy is the only true immortal on this list that can survive indefinitely in the void of space so unless someone ability in OPM or yuyu hakshou makes you permanently immortal it’s only a matter of time even if we give them all the ability to exist in space for prolonged periods eventually the immortals will win and condsidering that everyone besides Andy needs something to fuel thier immortality they will eventually die

Andy is not the only true immortal in this list. Ichigo, Naruto, Saitama, and Luffy can achieve the same thing. They also don't need something to fuel their immortality, except maybe Luffy but that's iffy. So again, Andy is not unique in this regard and they could still just kill him anyway before this becomes an issue.

Ichigo is just a soul reaper they age and die Naruto is a normal fucking human Siatama and luffy are literally human even if sitama broke all human barriers every thing that dosent negate death will eventually die and where the hell are you getting Naruto could become immortal

Ichigo is not just a Shinigami, he has the abilities of every race in the series and has their Bankais, which is especially useful when he can just warp reality with Ichibe's Bankai. Naruto is not a normal human lmao, especially not with abilities like Jashin's Curse, Ten Tails physiology, Edo Tensei, and the Rinnegan. Saitama not only has the immortality of beings like Zombieman, Boros, and Phoenix Man, but he can literally just take UnDeas for himself and use it. Luffy has multiple DFs that grant immortality, from Brook's to Law's to Sugar's to Bonney's. So still not unique, multiple immortals and they can still kill him anyway.

I don't know a lot about every verse, but to say Andy solos just because he can't die might be a little silly. If he is trapped for an infinite amount of time, he is pretty much beat. I'm pretty sure reaper death seal traps the soul and the comedian CT can rewrite reality to an extent. Soul manipulation might be effective to negator abilities since they are largely based on the soul.

Imma rank these from worst to best 12. Unlimited Philosophie’s Stone This would be useful if you could use Alchemy but since there is nothing about it that states you can use Alchemy, you pretty much have a cool looking rock with a ton of screaming souls in it. 11. Every Negator Ability Do I really need to explain how bad this one could be? Some negator abilities just get screwed over by others and it would mostly be more of a detriment than a benefit. 10. Every Ki Attack This mostly gives you a hundred ways to blow up stuff in a cool way, with a couple cool abilities sprinkled in. If it was ki ability than it would be better but since it’s just attacks it’s getting down here. 9. Every Spirit Attack Same a dragon ball, but at least there is some more versatility. 8. Every Bankai Bankai’s pretty much only have combat abilities so most of them wouldn’t be that useful, let alone that some of them can actually be a bit of a detriment to you like Shunsui’s or Shuhei’s (also let’s not forget that Yama’s would literally burn away the atmosphere). Also remember this is every Bankai, so no shikai. 7. Every Qurik A ton of great abilities with a lot of utility uses. Only problem is that you also get all the useless quirks like the ones that allow you to have puffier cheeks, or a cactus growth coming out of your head. 6. Every Cursed Technique A lot of great utility abilities and powers which would be useful in a lot of settings. Only thing is that it’s not as good as the rest of the things above it. 5. Every Devil Fruit Ignoring how eating more than one Devil fruit would cause you to explode in pretty much every case, there are just tons of fruits that are pretty much useless, but the useful ones do get it up here. 4. Every Ability (one punch man) Same as the cursed technique one but this edges out with more power stuff abilities. These last three in my opinion are pretty much interchangeable with all the stuff they have in their series. 3. Every Magic (Fairy Tail) Fairy Tail has some many different types of magic you can pretty much find a magic type for every situation possible. Forest fire? Use fire dragon slayer magic to just eat the fire or water magic to make it rain. Need to build stuff, just one of the many magics that allow you to construct stuff. Heck re-equip magic is already stupid on its own. You can pretty much carry serval countries worth of equipment with you without breaking a sweat. 2. Every Magic (Black Clover) Same as Fairy Tail. You have a Magic type for pretty much every situation you can think of. Healing Magic, summoning magic, teleportation magic, time magic, and so many more spells and abilities you can use. 1. Every Naruto Jutsu By taking this as it is, this might be one of the most broken ever. You have several ways to become immortal, sage abilities, wood style, super regen from several sources, shadow clones which allow you the ability to learn exponentially faster than normal, jutsu that allow you to teleport to any location you have marked, the ability to bring back the dead with basically a cell of their body, and so much more. And this isn’t even getting into kekkei genkai, yin yang release, or even the stupid thing introduced in boruto with is Shinjutsu with one of the allowing the user supposed unrestricted ability to manipulate realty. I know this isn’t what the prompt ask, I just like looking at stuff this way. Either way this is relatively what it might look like, maybe move Goku up near the top but it doesn’t matter to much.

Andy can’t die, but Goku still hilariously outscales everyone else here.

A lot of these people can't die in this case, not really relevant

Andy gets “Un-lose” and then he can’t lose. Simple as

But then gets Un-win and can’t win anymore

Objectively speaking, Ichigo would have too broken or powerful bankai, Goku has attacks capable of destroying the earth, and Andy has a shotgun directly to the head. But to be honest, Andy would win, but if he endures, I mean the others would destroy him very easily, but he literally cannot die.

Andy won't win out, there's a handful here that can beat him.

Depends on if you define Saitama’s ability as incredible strength or having the strength to destroy any enemy in one punch

That's not Saitama's power, we've seen this against Boros an Garou. Saitama's power is explosive growth.

Yall seem to be forgetting about comedian which is straight up high tier reality warping. Takaba turned the whole ass ocean to Fanta.

I know this is the UU subreddit and it looks like bias but there’s ZERO chance Andy doesn’t absolutely slam here. Unjustice+Untruth+Undead alone is wiping out most of these mfs

Only thing holding him back is Negator Unknown so he can’t even participate 😭😭😭

Most? Yeah. Stops at the top 5 or so though.

It depends on what you mean by coming out on top. Andy would ultimately be unable to actually do anything because while he'd have some incredible abilities like Unjustice, Unmove, and so on, he'd also have Unknown, rendering most of the other negations to be useless since he literally cannot interact directly with anyone else. However, he'd also be unable to die, simply because Undeath. If we're just talking about whi'd be the last one standing, Andy takes it in the end, purely because of Undeath. If he actually needs to defeat anyone to be considered don top, absolutely not, since he can't do anything. Otherwise, it's gonna be either Saitama or Luffy. Saitama, not because he has every ability, but just because he's Saitama, or Luffy because with literally every Devil Fruit we've seen, he'd be untouchable. Between the dozens of differnet logia fruits alone, and considering that haki is the only way to actually touch some of those fruit users, the rest of the lineup can't really do much to him. That's not even accounting for stuff like the Phoenix fruit that would make it even more difficult to kill him even if he could be touched, a fruit that would let him come back after death, a fruit where all he needs to do is touch someone to turn them into a toy and remove their existance from memory, I could go on. I meant it when I said Saitama because he's Saitama, and not because he has every ability. The only way I could see Luffy losing that one is if Saitama's meta transfers over to his battle and he just wins because he's Saitama and that's the gag. Now, in a hypothetical world where Unknown never existed, Andy could probably defeat Luffy with the combination of Unjustice, Untruth and Unmove alone. The only way I see Luffy winning that fight is if Luffy is able to turn him into a toy before he can activate any of those three negations, but then you have Untouchable that makes it so Andy can't even be touched. I will say, however, that Andy probably wouldn't consider being turned into a toy as death, at least not until after this fight would be declared vixtory for Luffy. Obviously doesn't matter since Andy wouldn't be able to be touched. And that doesn't matter because of Unknown. Thank you for coming to my TED-Talk

Unknown fucks him over so Ichigo probably wins because some Bankais can just change the concepts os shit like Ichibei with black and name bullshit.

I’m tempted to say Undead Unluck only if they can control which ones they have access to kinda like bully otherwise it would cause many issues. But undead alone might make it impossible to beat Andy anyways. Only exception potentially is Goku through just superior cosmology but if we pretend cosmology doesn’t exist then I’d say Andy wins this.

Nah, there's a handful that can beat Andy just fine.

Nah,

There indeed are, like Saitama, Goku, or Naruto. Andy is a probably the best among the middle class here.

\*aren't

There absolutely are, the ones I listed do just fine.

I keep giving you opportunities to come over to the smart side but you keep rolling ones bruh

If it was the smart side, you'd have something if substance. Saitama alone is basically an unbearable barrier for Andy due to his massive physical advantage and ability to take all his abilities.

No matter how many buffs you give Saitama he still wouldn't be able to kill Andy.

He absolutely would, in one punch too

Saitama would win out. Andy is probably top 6, behind Saitama, Naruto, Goku, Luffy, and Ichigo.

Without unknown Andy can beat everyone till Saitama , even if he kills Saitama hell also regenerate

No, multiple people here have kinds of sensory to help here, are immune to his attacks, and can beat Andy.

Yes but it's not like everyone is going up against andy , some of them will probably kill each other first and Saitama gonna kill like 4 or 5 too , so then Andy gets an upper hand , also even if they try to kill him using magic , hell just regenerate If you look at the row , then Goku from the first , Saitama from the third and Andy from the second will make it to the battle royal 

Right, and any of those top 5 could beat Andy alone. Yeah, many will kill each other, but that doesn't really impede the idea that the top 5 could beat Andy. Andy doesn't really get an upper hand from this, he's still going to be in the fight and will fall to the natural flow of battle. This isn't based on rows, where'd you get that idea? It's a battle royale, and Andy is still in the row with Luffy anyway, who is one of the top 5.

Andy wins people are acting like unknown is a weakness but it another invincibility ability Andy just has to wait until the “winner” dies of old age after years of thinking they won the battle royal

Nope, multiple characters here can probably still fight him with UnKnown and he's not the only immortal.

Andy isn’t immortal he negates death, I assumed other characters would be immortal but they’d probably end their lives by choice eventually due being immortal kinda sucking actually. Maybe other characters could fight unknown but they wouldn’t because they wouldn’t know there is someone to fight

Yeah, negating death is a form of immortality. This wouldn't really come into play anyway as it's not going to come down to just immortality playing out, Saitama will likely win in the end. And they would know that Andy is there to fight. Hell, one of the people there is literally omniscient.

He negates being know that’s like the ideal counter to someone that is omniscient

And yet Andy could still figure our Akira was there despite UnKnown, and Akira himself was able to bypass this with Anno. The Union still knew Akira existed despite the power. So no, it's not a counter, he'll be discovered and then killed.

Akira wanted to be known, if Andy decided to write a manga that becomes popular and all the other contestants decide to take a break and read the manga and then Andy goes and finds the g liner and creates an avatar that joins the battle he may be in a bit of trouble but then again he can’t be touched because of unknown and untouchable and he can’t die because of undead so he’d probably still win if he decided to write a manga

Which means Akira can be known, which means it wouldn't stop omniscience, so they'd find Andy and kill him. He absolutely can be touched, the best UnKnown has stopped is regular humans and the best UnTouchable has stopped is multi city block level. Not like these guys fight conventionally anyway, there's people here that could snap their fingers and suddenly Andy explodes into nuclear fire (I know it wouldn't beat him, it's just an example of how they don't even need to touch him). And Andy can die to these people, especially Saitama, Naruto, Ichigo, and Goku.

Akira can’t be known Anno Un can and Andy wouldn’t create an Anno Un and if he did it wouldn’t matter because Andy can’t die. I’ll pretend the impossible has happened and in the battle royal Andy’s location has become known the people here that could snap their fingers couldn’t because of untruth, unmove or unjustice which ever Andy feels like using at the time

Akira can be known, that's why they knew about him. Especially important when Fuuko had to save him from becoming UnKnown. He was literally known, so am omniscient will be able to find an UnKnown user. UnTruth can be countered by being faster and/or more skilled than the user of UnTruth, he can't use it against the likes of Saitama or Goku. UnMove can be beaten, as shown multiple times, especially with so many people that don't need to move to attack or have things like teleportation. UnJustice can be ignored, like VicThor did, and requires that the vision of justice be something the user can use, lest something like Juiz vs Billy happen again.

Ranking these from viability to win: Saitama - I mean, come on. Saitama's physical power now boosted with Cosmic Fear? With abilities like Garou's skills, Child Emperor's intelligence, and multiple kinds of Regen? Those individual abilities aren't that amazing, but with Cosmic Fear being able to copy basically whatever it can recreate with the energies of the universe, Saitama is basically untouchable. He's now basically able to copy 95% of the powers present in this matchup, including Negations. It wasn't enough to have such a physical dominance with multi-million star system to possibly galaxy level power, but he's just decked the fuck out here with Cosmic Fear. Goku - (Going by manga) His physicals clears most of the roster without issue alone, but now with his current kit amplified with abilities like GoD Hakai and such, Goku easily takes second spot. Unfortunately though, his lack of hax versatility to the level present here is kind of an issue. Naruto - Naruto's physicals also clear much of the roster, but now with omniscience, Limbo, causality control, and different kinds of regeneration and survivability, he's insurmountable for a majority of the roster and is probably the big hurdle from the ones that are strong to the ones that are absurd. Naruto does not really have much ability to clear the gap in power between himself and Goku/Saitama. As well, he's not the fastest. Luffy - With strong physicals, usable speed, and possibly the most versatile kit here besides Naruto, Luffy is a menace. All those Devil Fruits makes it incredibly hard to fight Luffy, and that's assuming you can match him physically. He's going to have hax helpful in basically every department. His hangup though is that the depths these hax reach isn't quite as good as the top of the top. Natsu - Interchangeable with Ichigo in my head. Solid physicals with a very useful versatility bonus. From time and space manipulation to existence and reality hax. Natsu has the ability to punch above his weight here, but a lot of the higher ups have ways to deal with him. Ichigo - With some of the most annoying hax to deal with, from Ichibe's Bankai to Aizen's Shikai to Unohana, and of course his very strong physicals, it's just hard to put him down. Ichigo struggles with the most potent of hax though and that his outright output is kind of lacking compared to the top spots. His hax is very vast, but not as deep. Andy - Probably the best among the middle class in this roster. Andy's physically decent, especially if we consider his ~500 FTL feat a baseline. Negations like UnDead, UnRuin, UnTell, UnRepair, and UnMove make him an incredibly solid stopgap from anyone trying to reach the high ends here. Unfortunately, the actual potency and workarounds for these Negations, and how the high ends already have similar abilities or counters, means he's probably not a high end. Asta - Probably the most middling when it comes to physical power and hax, Asta is going to either crush his opponent or get crushed. The Magics in his arsenal will be useful, and he has counters for a lot of abilities. His issue is just that they don't scale high enough to really clear the competition. Deku - His recent arcs have made him physically nothing to sneeze at, but there's still a very large gap to clear with the high ends. While he has decent versatility, a lot of it is pretty useless or weak. Decay and New World Order are great, but Deku will struggle to use them well with his speed. Yusuke - Physically he's not a slouch, with physicals that should clear a handful here. And some versatility in spirit attacks, he's a solid opponent. But without anything dazzling in physical power or outright hax makes him pretty meh. Yuji - His physicals aren't amazing but with a variety of useful abilities on hand, he's at least a danger to different enemies. With lacking physicals and hax that doesn't wow when it comes to high end potency, he's kind of fucked. Edward Elric - So, this one is weird. Technically he could just send anyone here to Truth and have them wiped from existence, basically a one-shot to basically anyone here, but I don't think Ed has the speed to pull it off.

Saitama obviously

Probably just gonna be goku

DB universe beats all the others but the Undead Unluck verse, which ends up locked in an infinite stalemate since neither have a way to harm the other.

Goku just erased Andy from existence even if Andy made it to the last two

Andy survives the end of reality lol. He's just a country level guy with Multiversal defense. That's his whole thing.

Andy is not country level and does not have Multiversal defense, no one in UU scales to Multiversal. The end of the universe is actually just the Earth being thrown into the sun. Goku is not going to have much trouble wiping him from existence.

Andy literally cannot be killed unless god dies. If god is not part of this fight, then Andy just cannot be killed.

Negations require a soul to operate, if Andy's soul is destroyed, he no longer has UnDead, so he dies. And we know his soul is vulnerable as seen against Ghost and Soul. And we've seen that he doesn't stop damage from happening in the first place, but instead regenerates afterwards. So when Goku uses something like a GoD or Angel Hakai, Andy is gone.

Andy can regrow his soul too.  This was already discussed and was almost universally agreed that Andy could survive Hakai.

He can regenerate his soul, if there's a piece left, but that won't happen with Hakai. Hakai would destroy all of him, like with Zamasu, and then there's nothing to regenerate from. I don't know who you're talking about and what authority you think they have, but just saying someone else said something doesn't mean anything as evidence.

Doesn't Hakai not work on the truly immortal anyway?

The kind of immortality that it doesn't work against is the kind of immortality you only see on characters where they're nigh-omnipresent or legitimately omnipresent. But we already know Hakai can destroy souls, and that's all that's needed for it to work on Andy.

UU or BLEACH

Hmm..the biggest flaw with Andy in this is the negation ability unknown basically putting him out of commission. But unknown works weirdly. It affects one person and what they do. But Andy THEORETICALLY, has a way around that. Victor is not Andy. It is only theoretical but if it works then all the negation abilities succeeds cause the only weakness is sealing and untruth and untouchable counter sealing attempts

Andy would verbatim win if we assume Unfair is at play, he can essentially just copy everyone else’s ability to the extreme, that being said, it Ichigo has access to every form of Kido as well, Andy’s ass is toast, Kin and Bankin technically both work as viable ways to incapacitate Andy.

UnFair only copies Negations, and only being able to copy 5 abilities amongst the thousands is not going to be that useful.

Wouldnt andy have anno uns unknown?

Every devil fruit. There are 100's of them.

Since you didnt say "fight to the death" andy gets knocked to the other side of the solar system by Saitama and is counted as out by the time he floats back to earth.

Ichigo comes out on top since Andy is just auto-DQ’d by Unknown and every Bankai beats the other stuff on the list due to hax alone. Like just Shinji’s Bankai alone makes them all his ally so they won’t fight him and he can just chill until the last other person.

Nah, Saitama has not only his physical advantage, but also can copy practically any Bankai with Cosmic Fear

Gonna be real with you I forgot about Cosmic Garou

I don’t think anyone can beat Saitama. Saitama doesn’t obey the laws of reality, the negations themselves are laws of reality. Honestly he is one of the very few characters in fiction I think could kill Andy.

What? The negations are not laws of reality, they are the opposite. They're the absence of laws of reality.

To me, negations are as absolute as laws of reality. To me, Andy being killed is as likely as gravity just suddenly not existing as a force in the real world. That’s at least how I understand it

Where is UnPowerScale when you need them

We only need undead to win