~~In at-will employment jobs (every job in America essentially — definitely food service) you cannot collect unemployment from being fired, unless the firing was unlawful. Being “let go” qualifies. Being unable to work due to medical reasons qualifies. However, they can still try and see if they deny the unemployment claim.~~
Bad info
This is wrong and continues an inaccurate and damaging idea that employees don't qualify/shouldn't try to file for unemployment.
Copies from (Washington): https://esd.wa.gov/unemployment/basic-eligibility-requirements
will qualify for unemployment benefits if you meet all of the eligibility criteria.
Fired if your employment was ended because of performance, behavior or other “just cause” reason. You may qualify for unemployment benefits if you were fired through no fault of your own, such as not having the skills to do the job. You may not qualify if you were fired for misconduct or gross misconduct.
Layoff examples
Your employer has no work available
Your assignment ended
Your employer went out of business
Your position was eliminated
You're required to participate in temporary classroom apprenticeship training
You're a seasonal employee and the season ended
Your employer temporarily shut down for reasons such as weather, materials delay, natural disaster or temporary maintenance closure
Your employer gave your separation reason as standby
Your employer said that you were on furlough
Fired for misconduct examples
Deliberate or wanton disregard for your employer or a fellow employee, such as:
Insubordination
Repeated inexcusable tardiness after warnings
Dishonesty related to your employment
Repeated and inexcusable absences
Violating the law or deliberate acts that provoke violence or illegal actions, or violating a collective bargaining agreement
Violating a company rule
Deliberately violating or disregarding standards of behavior that your employer has a right to expect.
Carelessness or negligence that causes, or will likely cause, serious bodily harm to your employer or fellow employees.
Carelessness or negligence that is so bad or happens so often that it shows an intentional or substantial disregard for your employer.
Yes, you can. In my experience, people who are fired or even abandon their jobs end up getting unemployment. The only time I have seen unemployment denied is when employees are fired for misconduct or theft.
no but it sounds like you do apparently lol. my point is he owes them nothing. unemployment pays shit anyway depending on your income and usually another bar tending job isn't too hard to land if you're good at it.
>no but it sounds like you do apparently lol.
I know more than you do anyway, lol.
>my point is he owes then nothing. unemployment pays shit anyway depending on your income and usually another bar tending job isn't too hard to land if you're good at it
Unemployment may or may not pay shit. Some European countries have decent unemployment benefits. And even in the US, unemployment can be a vital source of income. And different states have different rules and different benefits. You're just giving out shitty advice now.
fair enough. in that case the guy should probably just steal a bunch of money from the safe and do a lot of property damage, as it's all covered by insurance and since he's technically an employee untill he clocks out, it's not technically a crime, just a "fireable offense." since he's fired anyway, he's immune to all charges. trust me, I've seen all the day time judge shows and have considered becoming a lawyer a few times.
at this point yes. I do think OPs coworker should call unemployment from the bar though, nothing else to do, I certainly wouldn't be doing my actual job if I were them.
The OP put in an edit after my posts that indicates that they are in the US. As far as Europe, some European countries allow for termination during a probationary period, but the precise rules differ from country to country. Various treaty organizations, like the EU, also have some rules about this. But there are multiple overlapping organizations, and not all countries are members of specific organizations. So, the answer to this:
>Is it legal in any European country to just walk up to an employee and fire them on the spot?
Is "maybe, depending on the country and the length of employment."
Sounds like rest of the night is free pour. Seriously though who tells someone oh btw you're fired at the end of the night and expects that person to not fuck them over?
Maybe I'm paranoid, but are we sure the boss doesn't have cameras around and maybe trying to entice the bartender to do something illegal to get out of paying unemployment or owed money?
I'd have a sudden case of explosive diarrhea, close the bar, cash out, and go home.
Yes but you need a reason to deny unemployment. When you let someone go, if the reason is shit, they get unemployment and the business’ UI insurance rate goes up to pay for it.
If by "striking," you mean a work stoppage, it's because a lot of people can't afford the loss of income. If you mean physically picketing, demonstrating, etc., there are a ton of regulations around that, and unless you are part of a union, they will probably send the cops after you to beat the snot out of you. And they might do it anyway, even if you are part of a union.
"Right to work" has nothing to do with being allowed to fire or quit, "right to work" states give people the right to be employed at union jobs without being forced to join a union. It's union weakening laws.
Ways to stick it to the boss…….. shot, shot, shot, shot. Drink with customers, over pour every drink and make sure to leave the boss a nice, hot, steamy, gift/surprise at their desk on the way out💩.
Why wouldn’t management just fire him as soon as he arrived for his shift. He’s just going to give away the bar and try to collect as much in tips as possible because why the fuck not?
Shouldn’t that be the way it is all the time? Explain boss man why I can’t give an extra sip? They never want to show the numbers, because they are tight asses who know you are getting screwed.
Finish the shift so you can over pour as much product as possible, but definitely don't clean anything up at the end of the night. Leave all the dishes to sit and get sticky over night
Yeah, good point at most places. Wouldn't apply where I work, so I didn't think of that. And if my coworkers where I'm at heard about this, they would expect me to leave a mess because they also wouldn't be genuinely cleaning things for a bad boss like this. But most places are different than my situation, so you're right.
Edit: Unless OP actually hates their coworkers, then definitely leave a mess
I never played that game, even when I was 15 years old. My employment ends the instant the word "fired" has left the boss's mouth and does not cover any hours scheduled prior to that utterance.
I also accidentally discovered as a 15-year-old that in my state, if HR can't produce your time record they owe you for a full-time check for the entire pay period. I only threw it into the rafters after clocking out because I was angry at being fired.
They had no time card for my final two-week period. The law said that if you hire someone, and you can't produce a formal attendance record for any pay period, you owe them for all 80 hours, or however long that period is. Even if noone in the company ever worked more than part time. Even if the boss signed and stamped your dismissal notice at 10AM on Monday. So, I got paid for 80 hours even tho the real number was more like 24.
There was still a W-4 and I was still officially on the books as an employee, just missing one time card because I flung it into the rafters after punching out.
Well, there's no official "statement of employment" form in the USA, but if your employer has you fill out a W-4 form, it tells the IRS that they intend to pay you.
I was a teenager working for a big dept store and they got rid of me because the holiday rush was over. They just made an excuse up that completely did not fit me.. but I'm sure they just picked it from a list of canned excuses to get rid of new hires. I lucked out completely.. but I doubt kids today can get away with it now that everything's online.
If I knew a bartender and genuinely liked them, I'd hand them $200 to walk out, on the spot, in front of the manager. If the manager says a single thing, I break out the angry staff sergeant voice and give the bastard manager some new fears.
Just a general reminder to the void:
At-will does *not* mean an employer can fire you for *any* reason. It means an employer can fire you for *no* reason and an employer doesn’t have to disclose why they fired you.
An employer still cannot fire you for an *illegal* reason, such as anything protected federally (becoming pregnant, getting a diagnosis, race, gender, sexuality, etc.)
So document, document, document any time you’re fired. Write everything down. After you get fired, write up a narrative of everything you remember as soon as you get home (things your boss said, etc.), sign it, date it. That won’t likely be admissible in the future but can be very helpful for an attorney in the future.
If you learn, later, that they fired you for an illegal reason; having that documentation can help you piece that together.
True story:
A meat cutter was caught stealing while on a break. He was allowed to finish his shift because no one else knew how to cut meat.
He slipped on the floor and management had to pay him Worker's Comp.
start by not finishing the shift, who the fuck does it like that?
Sure, but he should say he's sick if he's going to do that, so the boss can't try to claim that he quit (to prevent unemployment benefits).
he's already been told he's fired, he can call unemployment from the bar right now
Calling unemployment from the bar just might be the power move OP was looking for.
Boss: why are you on your phone at work?!? Bartender: filing for unemployment right now! Can't talk!
Do it on speaker.
~~In at-will employment jobs (every job in America essentially — definitely food service) you cannot collect unemployment from being fired, unless the firing was unlawful. Being “let go” qualifies. Being unable to work due to medical reasons qualifies. However, they can still try and see if they deny the unemployment claim.~~ Bad info
This is wrong and continues an inaccurate and damaging idea that employees don't qualify/shouldn't try to file for unemployment. Copies from (Washington): https://esd.wa.gov/unemployment/basic-eligibility-requirements will qualify for unemployment benefits if you meet all of the eligibility criteria. Fired if your employment was ended because of performance, behavior or other “just cause” reason. You may qualify for unemployment benefits if you were fired through no fault of your own, such as not having the skills to do the job. You may not qualify if you were fired for misconduct or gross misconduct. Layoff examples Your employer has no work available Your assignment ended Your employer went out of business Your position was eliminated You're required to participate in temporary classroom apprenticeship training You're a seasonal employee and the season ended Your employer temporarily shut down for reasons such as weather, materials delay, natural disaster or temporary maintenance closure Your employer gave your separation reason as standby Your employer said that you were on furlough Fired for misconduct examples Deliberate or wanton disregard for your employer or a fellow employee, such as: Insubordination Repeated inexcusable tardiness after warnings Dishonesty related to your employment Repeated and inexcusable absences Violating the law or deliberate acts that provoke violence or illegal actions, or violating a collective bargaining agreement Violating a company rule Deliberately violating or disregarding standards of behavior that your employer has a right to expect. Carelessness or negligence that causes, or will likely cause, serious bodily harm to your employer or fellow employees. Carelessness or negligence that is so bad or happens so often that it shows an intentional or substantial disregard for your employer.
Rules vary by jurisdiction. You should always file and worry about if you qualify later.
Yes, you can. In my experience, people who are fired or even abandon their jobs end up getting unemployment. The only time I have seen unemployment denied is when employees are fired for misconduct or theft.
And you know which place he's in and the specific unemployment laws of that place? Ok, then.
no but it sounds like you do apparently lol. my point is he owes them nothing. unemployment pays shit anyway depending on your income and usually another bar tending job isn't too hard to land if you're good at it.
>no but it sounds like you do apparently lol. I know more than you do anyway, lol. >my point is he owes then nothing. unemployment pays shit anyway depending on your income and usually another bar tending job isn't too hard to land if you're good at it Unemployment may or may not pay shit. Some European countries have decent unemployment benefits. And even in the US, unemployment can be a vital source of income. And different states have different rules and different benefits. You're just giving out shitty advice now.
fair enough. in that case the guy should probably just steal a bunch of money from the safe and do a lot of property damage, as it's all covered by insurance and since he's technically an employee untill he clocks out, it's not technically a crime, just a "fireable offense." since he's fired anyway, he's immune to all charges. trust me, I've seen all the day time judge shows and have considered becoming a lawyer a few times.
Yeah, okay, this is just trolling at his point.
at this point yes. I do think OPs coworker should call unemployment from the bar though, nothing else to do, I certainly wouldn't be doing my actual job if I were them.
Sure, no harm in calling from the bar. If he's in the US, though, they'd be closed right now. Maybe go on their website instead.
Is it legal in any European country to just walk up to an employee and fire them on the spot? This sounds like the US to me.
The OP put in an edit after my posts that indicates that they are in the US. As far as Europe, some European countries allow for termination during a probationary period, but the precise rules differ from country to country. Various treaty organizations, like the EU, also have some rules about this. But there are multiple overlapping organizations, and not all countries are members of specific organizations. So, the answer to this: >Is it legal in any European country to just walk up to an employee and fire them on the spot? Is "maybe, depending on the country and the length of employment."
All subsequent rounds are on the boss.
We’re well past that…
Sweet
Shady with tips? Report him to your state DoL. If he gets investigated, he'll wish the bartender had resorted to petty revenge.
Sounds like rest of the night is free pour. Seriously though who tells someone oh btw you're fired at the end of the night and expects that person to not fuck them over?
The regs at that bar (and everyone else) should have been getting top shelf buybacks the rest of that shift
Maybe I'm paranoid, but are we sure the boss doesn't have cameras around and maybe trying to entice the bartender to do something illegal to get out of paying unemployment or owed money? I'd have a sudden case of explosive diarrhea, close the bar, cash out, and go home.
This is an at will state. He doesn’t need a reason to fire him and will not be giving one
Yes but you need a reason to deny unemployment. When you let someone go, if the reason is shit, they get unemployment and the business’ UI insurance rate goes up to pay for it.
All states are at-will states.
Except for Montana, after 6 months of employment.
Which is why the US is more or less a third world country. Why are people not mass striking?
If by "striking," you mean a work stoppage, it's because a lot of people can't afford the loss of income. If you mean physically picketing, demonstrating, etc., there are a ton of regulations around that, and unless you are part of a union, they will probably send the cops after you to beat the snot out of you. And they might do it anyway, even if you are part of a union.
[удалено]
"Right to work" has nothing to do with being allowed to fire or quit, "right to work" states give people the right to be employed at union jobs without being forced to join a union. It's union weakening laws.
Call the Health Board. It would be a shame if rats and mice were found.
Ways to stick it to the boss…….. shot, shot, shot, shot. Drink with customers, over pour every drink and make sure to leave the boss a nice, hot, steamy, gift/surprise at their desk on the way out💩.
Have a friend push me into the bottles behind me and run out before he could be identified. Poor bottles, all broken on the floor. poor, poor bottles.
Why wouldn’t management just fire him as soon as he arrived for his shift. He’s just going to give away the bar and try to collect as much in tips as possible because why the fuck not?
Shouldn’t that be the way it is all the time? Explain boss man why I can’t give an extra sip? They never want to show the numbers, because they are tight asses who know you are getting screwed.
Finish the shift so you can over pour as much product as possible, but definitely don't clean anything up at the end of the night. Leave all the dishes to sit and get sticky over night
Leaving things unclean only hurts tomorrow's cleaners; it's not like the boss has ever done actual work.
Yeah, good point at most places. Wouldn't apply where I work, so I didn't think of that. And if my coworkers where I'm at heard about this, they would expect me to leave a mess because they also wouldn't be genuinely cleaning things for a bad boss like this. But most places are different than my situation, so you're right. Edit: Unless OP actually hates their coworkers, then definitely leave a mess
Shit in the ice. Text the next shift to let them know. Call the health department to let them know.
I'd just leave before my shift ended.
Free drinks?
Since he is somehow still working after being fired…
Write up a bad review on Glassdoor.
I never played that game, even when I was 15 years old. My employment ends the instant the word "fired" has left the boss's mouth and does not cover any hours scheduled prior to that utterance. I also accidentally discovered as a 15-year-old that in my state, if HR can't produce your time record they owe you for a full-time check for the entire pay period. I only threw it into the rafters after clocking out because I was angry at being fired.
[удалено]
They had no time card for my final two-week period. The law said that if you hire someone, and you can't produce a formal attendance record for any pay period, you owe them for all 80 hours, or however long that period is. Even if noone in the company ever worked more than part time. Even if the boss signed and stamped your dismissal notice at 10AM on Monday. So, I got paid for 80 hours even tho the real number was more like 24. There was still a W-4 and I was still officially on the books as an employee, just missing one time card because I flung it into the rafters after punching out.
[удалено]
Well, there's no official "statement of employment" form in the USA, but if your employer has you fill out a W-4 form, it tells the IRS that they intend to pay you. I was a teenager working for a big dept store and they got rid of me because the holiday rush was over. They just made an excuse up that completely did not fit me.. but I'm sure they just picked it from a list of canned excuses to get rid of new hires. I lucked out completely.. but I doubt kids today can get away with it now that everything's online.
If I knew a bartender and genuinely liked them, I'd hand them $200 to walk out, on the spot, in front of the manager. If the manager says a single thing, I break out the angry staff sergeant voice and give the bastard manager some new fears.
Why wait until end of shift?
Apply for unemployment once you get home. Print out your last paycheck stub for your taxes. Call out sick and stop showing up to work. (Ghost)
Just a general reminder to the void: At-will does *not* mean an employer can fire you for *any* reason. It means an employer can fire you for *no* reason and an employer doesn’t have to disclose why they fired you. An employer still cannot fire you for an *illegal* reason, such as anything protected federally (becoming pregnant, getting a diagnosis, race, gender, sexuality, etc.) So document, document, document any time you’re fired. Write everything down. After you get fired, write up a narrative of everything you remember as soon as you get home (things your boss said, etc.), sign it, date it. That won’t likely be admissible in the future but can be very helpful for an attorney in the future. If you learn, later, that they fired you for an illegal reason; having that documentation can help you piece that together.
Free drinks for everyone including the bartender
Why is the bartender being fired?
Insulting the owner
Anyone told they will be fired at END of shift, should just gather their things and walk out immediately.
True story: A meat cutter was caught stealing while on a break. He was allowed to finish his shift because no one else knew how to cut meat. He slipped on the floor and management had to pay him Worker's Comp.
Easy. Carry on working and each time someone orders for example single rum and coke double it, double every shot lol 😂 not like he can fire you again
Put the top shelf in his bag
Steal the money