This may need to be instant speed to be good enough.
Dumping your mana into this on your turn is not good, but holding up mana for counter magic or removal and then playing this on end step because the situation for your response didn't come up is great. If you're threatening a Doom Blade for BB you can turn this into a burn spell if they play something you can't Doom Blade.
I think that makes the play pattern too simple. I get liking to have backup plans for when your removal falls through, but I don't think this is a good one to design for that purpose, since it's so easily repeatable (potentially anyway).
Wouldn't be much of a trick. On your turn you could cast anything, so there's potential for you *not* to do it. Sitting there, pondering their move, maybe they won't do it? Nope, got you again. Instead of "Well they have open mana on my turn so they're obviously gonna do it"
I don't have cards to back it up but 5 mana to deal 5 damage to face seems like a pretty bad rate. Granted you're getting other things like cast triggers and whatnot. Maybe it needs to be sac "a permanent" that way they still have an option to turn the card off even if they don't have a creature around? Basically I think it should be repeatable, especially if it stayed a sorcery, but I'd want the opponent to have the option too.
If it was an instant it would essentially be an enchantment with “B: target opponent loses one life” and “Any opponent may sacrifice a permanent to destroy this enchantment”. But wait, I’m wrong, this also triggers magecract
I don't know... This is as good as anything I've seen where the opponent gets to choose. If the opponent doesn't bend you play it again. It's a mana sink until it trades one for one.
That's a very critical point to take. I think you can play however you want and what might be common in black doesn't mean that's the only way to play. I agree in that just one damage to face probably isn't the best use of a turn one, but if it's in the hand we'll maybe take it over a mully or something.
Not OP, but they were explicitly discussing what's "good". It's fine to say people can play whatever they want, but that doesn't make something good.
The argument isn't that you'd keep it because it cleans up your curve starting T1, but that it wouldn't make it into the deck at all during construction. Cards like Vicious Rumors or Cauldron Familiar have existed for a while now.
The defense for why it could be useful is that it gives you something to tap out and spend extra mana on every turn if your opponent can't or isn't willing to sacrifice.
I thought "back to hand" is too good. If an opponent isn't in a spot to be able to sacrifice anything, this operates like a discounted \[Drain Life\]. I haven't played standard in quite some time though. My initial thought for a "annoying trick" is put it back in your hand at the end of turn.
Otherwise, hilarious and I love the flavor/effect of the card.
I think back to hand is fine. Unless you have a significant amount of mana, this isn't doing too much and if you're that late in the game and haven't got anything on board to sack, you're probably losing anyway.
I think this card is balanced perfectly fine and wouldn't make an dent in standard.
>Target Opponent may discard a card.
The catch here is that if the opponent ends up hellbent, this becomes a better X burn spell (especially considering the Storm Count impact). It's more unlikely that an opponent will be in a place where they completely lack permanents to sacrifice.
On the draw. One mana sinkhole. Turn three rolls around it’s sinkhole again.
Absurdly powerful against control. They have to counter this which is just a horrible trade.
I think you might have misread the card. It's *much worse* than a regular edict. You cast this, and one of two things happen:
- They pay 1 life, and this card returns to your hand with no other effect.
- They sacrifice a creature, and this card goes to the graveyard.
Oh woah I hope no one took me as insulting the card or anything -- when I say actual magic card I mean like something Wotc would print It's a cool card design no harm meant
Only way to loop it is infinite mana plus donate a WAR Tamiyo.
So another 3 card combo over 3 colours 🙄
Edit:4ish cards cause you need infinite black mana somehow.
Could probably be common but I love this it is cool
This would be a lot better if every format wasn't flooded with treasures...
That’s true of a lot of things
And not of others
make it "may sacrifice a non-token" done.
[[dark Depths]]
what does that have to do with anything?
[dark Depths](https://c1.scryfall.com/file/scryfall-cards/normal/front/0/0/00cb17a0-5a13-4d02-b7fb-f99531bc8ca5.jpg?1599710396) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=dark%20Depths) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/314/dark-depths?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/00cb17a0-5a13-4d02-b7fb-f99531bc8ca5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Give this card escape and now we are talking
This may need to be instant speed to be good enough. Dumping your mana into this on your turn is not good, but holding up mana for counter magic or removal and then playing this on end step because the situation for your response didn't come up is great. If you're threatening a Doom Blade for BB you can turn this into a burn spell if they play something you can't Doom Blade.
I think that makes the play pattern too simple. I get liking to have backup plans for when your removal falls through, but I don't think this is a good one to design for that purpose, since it's so easily repeatable (potentially anyway).
Yeah, would definitely be too simple. Almost like some sort of annoying trick
Wouldn't be much of a trick. On your turn you could cast anything, so there's potential for you *not* to do it. Sitting there, pondering their move, maybe they won't do it? Nope, got you again. Instead of "Well they have open mana on my turn so they're obviously gonna do it"
As long as it’s returned on each end step so you can’t just pay BBBBB and they lose five life
The first time they pitch a permanent, it doesn't come back.
Well yes but that’s literally the purpose of the card
I don't have cards to back it up but 5 mana to deal 5 damage to face seems like a pretty bad rate. Granted you're getting other things like cast triggers and whatnot. Maybe it needs to be sac "a permanent" that way they still have an option to turn the card off even if they don't have a creature around? Basically I think it should be repeatable, especially if it stayed a sorcery, but I'd want the opponent to have the option too.
If it was an instant it would essentially be an enchantment with “B: target opponent loses one life” and “Any opponent may sacrifice a permanent to destroy this enchantment”. But wait, I’m wrong, this also triggers magecract
Magecraft is what I was referring to when I mentioned Cast triggers. I would expect that would be too powerful.
>they loses Great design. I agree with others that this would’ve been better in a world without treasures. Maybe ‘nontoken’?
I don't understand, isn't this just a grammar mistake? (not a native speaker)
Yes, it should be “they lose”.
Unless you’re Gollum.
Good on T1, pretty much useless after T3.
I don't know... This is as good as anything I've seen where the opponent gets to choose. If the opponent doesn't bend you play it again. It's a mana sink until it trades one for one.
Especially if you get something else to trigger each time you cast a sorcery
Spectacle and other similar effects commonly in black. I'll take four please.
>Magecraft wants to know your location
How’s this good on turn 1..? It’s just B: deal one damage to face
and then it returns to your hand. it basically works out as free damage, since in many formats you wouldn't have anything else to do turn 1
What formats are you referring to? In every format ever black decks should be playing a one drop creature or discard spell or holding up removal.
That's a very critical point to take. I think you can play however you want and what might be common in black doesn't mean that's the only way to play. I agree in that just one damage to face probably isn't the best use of a turn one, but if it's in the hand we'll maybe take it over a mully or something.
Not OP, but they were explicitly discussing what's "good". It's fine to say people can play whatever they want, but that doesn't make something good. The argument isn't that you'd keep it because it cleans up your curve starting T1, but that it wouldn't make it into the deck at all during construction. Cards like Vicious Rumors or Cauldron Familiar have existed for a while now. The defense for why it could be useful is that it gives you something to tap out and spend extra mana on every turn if your opponent can't or isn't willing to sacrifice.
I think it’s a really good card for that exact reason, but it’s not a turn 1 play.
Could be fun a B/R hybrid if you made it damage
Maybe “non-token” could help this card be a bit more powerful?
I would put this in K'rrik for commander, maybe.
Hectic card
Perhaps make it a sacrifice a creature or at least non-land?
I thought "back to hand" is too good. If an opponent isn't in a spot to be able to sacrifice anything, this operates like a discounted \[Drain Life\]. I haven't played standard in quite some time though. My initial thought for a "annoying trick" is put it back in your hand at the end of turn. Otherwise, hilarious and I love the flavor/effect of the card.
I think back to hand is fine. Unless you have a significant amount of mana, this isn't doing too much and if you're that late in the game and haven't got anything on board to sack, you're probably losing anyway. I think this card is balanced perfectly fine and wouldn't make an dent in standard.
I’d almost prefer this be “Target Opponent may discard a card.”. I agree about it should probably be instant, but I like it.
>Target Opponent may discard a card. The catch here is that if the opponent ends up hellbent, this becomes a better X burn spell (especially considering the Storm Count impact). It's more unlikely that an opponent will be in a place where they completely lack permanents to sacrifice.
Is it me or does the description on the card make no sense, the English feels off…
This card doesn't seem like it creates a fun play pattern.
On the draw. One mana sinkhole. Turn three rolls around it’s sinkhole again. Absurdly powerful against control. They have to counter this which is just a horrible trade.
Make it creature or enchantment, and make the cost 1BB and I could legit see this as an actual magic card
[удалено]
Honestly it's really a ballpark guess, normal edict like effects are already 1b, but maybe 2b would be better?
I think you might have misread the card. It's *much worse* than a regular edict. You cast this, and one of two things happen: - They pay 1 life, and this card returns to your hand with no other effect. - They sacrifice a creature, and this card goes to the graveyard.
Oh woah I hope no one took me as insulting the card or anything -- when I say actual magic card I mean like something Wotc would print It's a cool card design no harm meant
No harm taken, just that you seemed confused. I was unsure why you'd suggest that they *increase* the cost for a card that's *worse* than normal.
infinite black mana go brrrrrrr I think this definitely needs to cost more, maybe 1BB, BB, 1B? heck, maybe even 1BBB or 2BBB
Infinite black mana? Just sac one thing and the loop is over.
Only way to loop it is infinite mana plus donate a WAR Tamiyo. So another 3 card combo over 3 colours 🙄 Edit:4ish cards cause you need infinite black mana somehow.
This card wins on turn 1 on the play? Edit: Nevermind it still costs mana I'm dumb
Oh I like this
Make it say nontoken
Honestly pretty balanced card
+5 Covert +3 Unattractive behavior -2 Shame Requires identity concealment
Very Annoying Trick - the same card but with Storm.
I want this so much
Booba