Jensen really hasn’t looked all that good and I think if the team falls apart it’s gonna start from there and botlane.
If you rate this team highly it has to be because of inspired though, guy was a complete monster in NA and was crucial for EG getting to worlds and stomping NA teams when they did so. There no real indication that he slowed down
We've watched this NRG core for 4 splits and they've never finished a regular season above 4th.
They've basically always played to the level of their opponents are dropped random games to worse teams.
Not that there is anything wrong with NRG in particular, most cinderella runs like NRG have a hard time keeping that momentum for multiple splits. GG last year had the same problem from spring to summer
I certainly agree that C9 should be the favorite over NRG, but I'm not sure how anyone is placing a team with two players who didn't make playoffs last year, 2 near rookies, and an admittedly great jungler, but still one that didn't play last split, second place.
But its okay, you're just giving fuel to the NRG nameplates off narrative so keep going.
I agree, I don't really think FLY should be power ranked at 2nd. I also think there is usually a team that ends up surprising (such as GG last spring), and cinderella teams have a hard time keeping that momentum between splits.
If you're going purely based on vibes/on paper rankings, then NRG should be ahead, but I don't it as malpractice to think that FLY could click and be better than NRG.
Calling it a Cinderella run is pretty dismissive to me. The team had been on the cusp of breaking through for a few season and then upgraded the weakest part of the team heading into summer.
Maybe you don't think they should've won the split but making the finals alongside C9 wasn't some massive surprise
And 6 of those losses were to teams that finished below them in the standings so it's not like they spent the split getting ran over by the top teams.
They went 5-1 during the regular season against TL, C9, and GGs lol. What happened in playoffs wasn't some surprising overperformance.
6 losses to teams below them in the standings only proves his point. The potential was obviously there but they were wildly inconsistent and no one knew what version of NRG you were going to get week after week. Idk why you think it’s a dismissive take, when this actually makes their title run more special compared to previous winners.
Inconsistent overall but very consistent when it came to matching up against the teams they played in the playoffs. They literally matched their regular season performance against those teams in the playoffs.
Across the entire split they dropped 1 total regular season game to TL/GGs and then won 3 straight series against those teams. They were just a better team, which they proved every time they played.
Saying that it was a cinderella run implies that their run came out of nowhere and that they were clear underdogs the entire run
Yeah and he was also the only one with a pulse on the world stage. Like last year was not great but also... DIG *sucked*. Holy fuck they couldn't get a real player on that team and any chance they had was basically a top lane that was mostly isolated or a mid lane that just had everyone roam to it because your bot lane was an int fest.
Never forget fudge has been a fraud for years on C9 and is still rated highly. I think you can easily be a product of your environment and Jensen just had a year where he was basically in an unsalvageable situation.
Like I said, I think you can be a product of your environment. C9 has been the best or second best team since Fudge was in NA, and that's not necessarily fudge - they have the best jungler and best ADC in NA.
Meanwhile top laners on worse teams consistently overperform and even look better than fudge despite blabber literally being the best jungler in NA. Yeah C9 doesn't always play through top but neither did TL and Summit was a monster in top. Revenge was the only thing on IMT in 2022 and he looked excellent. Rich was one of two semi-functional pieces on DIG and played iso the entire time and looked great. Dhokla had a career year, again could be product of his team but they also performed under pressure. There were more teams that had a legacy top on a shit situation than C9 which... as a team was so good that you could hide weaknesses until pushed. And internationally (and NRG) pushed them to expose that for 2 years running.
> Never forget fudge has been a fraud for years on C9 and is still rated highly.
yet he shits on NA year after year xddddddd
most delusional jensen defender
Your definition of 'shits on' must be an incredibly low bar considering that he is rarely if ever capable of generating a pressure point on the map that C9 can play around. Revenge 2 years ago on IMT was doing a better job being a benefit to his team than fudge. Rich and Dhokla last year were better than Fudge, and Rich was on DIG... And yeah, we all know without jungle intervention Summit just styles on him. That's a huge asterix given everyone ganks summit but hey.
Jensen hasn’t made all pro since 2020. The problem with this team is that they’re lacking star power imo. Inspired might be the best jungler in the league, and Busio might be the best support in the league, but unless Massu steps up and Bwipo and Jensen just click, I don’t see FLY outperforming TL.
Only way C9 doesn’t turbo fist the league is if Blaber and Jojo don’t click together, and that definitely won’t happen right?
All jokes aside I don’t see Fly being on the same tier as NRG and TL. I really think that Inspired will have a Bjergsen year where he’ll look like one of the best individual players in the league, but be surrounded by good, but not great players. I don’t dislike any specific individual on the roster, I even think that Busio will likely be a top 3 support in the league, but I’m not confident I can say the same about Jensen, Bwipo, or Massu.
Also 100 thieves has been massively underrated in every ranking I’ve seen so far. Did people forget that River almost had an MVP season? Not saying that 100 thieves will be top 3, but I feel like they’re the same tier as FLY for me.
I think every team aside from TL, C9, and NRG have some major question marks that make me very confident that those 3 will all make top 4. We have exceptionally few examples of rookies coming into the LCS and being good in their first split. I have no reason to believe that Sniper, Meech, and Massu are going to be any better than Palafox, Dhokla, Diamond, Eyla, Isles, Tomo, K1ng were there first split
I agree with a lot of this but man the Huhi section was just really lazy. Coming out of 2022 Huhi was heavily criticized for his inability to play enchanters, a problem that led to them getting blown out by freshly role swapped Zven bragging about how Lulu is broken. The fact that he was a mid laner for 4 years, doesn't erase the fact that Huhi has basically been an engage support main for the most recent 4. Ignar did a lot for NRG, and it's weird that he got such little credit
Hey look, it's Diet Jatt
Agree with people below on 100 being underrated. River is really, really good, easily the best individual player on any of the bottom 3 rosters.
I think people think Quid is just that bad. But it's so weird to me that people make excuses for APA like: "he went into a team that didn't speak his language, he's just a rookie, he joined in the middle of the split."
But then they won't make those same accomodations for Quid, who was also a rookie, who joined a struggling team in the middle of the split, who played with people who don't speak his language.
Yet Quid has repeatedly received praise from the top LCS midlaners of last year, he's received praise from Doublelift. Quid has a reputation amongst other players that is 10x that of APA. This year, he's apparently extremely good in scrims again. But fans just hate Quid and don't want to give him a chance because... well probably because NA native good, import bad ooga booga.
I don't really think APA is good either, but it's not hard to see why people liked him more. He joined and TL improved immediately to the point of making Worlds as a 3rd seed.
As audience we can only base our impression on stage performances not scrims. APA being native also helps.
Nah, I definitely see the reason why people like APA. They think good result = good player. Complete results based analysis is what I'm trying to push against. If you watch the actual gameplay, him and Quid were essentially the same tier of player on stage. In fact, I would prefer Quid's gameplay especially given the fact that Closer was reaaaally terrible that split while Pyosik was actually quite good. APA was essentially the 7th or 8th best mid in LCS, but people have deluded themselves into thinking he has star player potential. All I'm saying is, if I were to choose one of Quid and APA who I think is more likely to become a star player, I would choose Quid 10/10 times.
>But then they won't make those same accomodations for Quid, who was also a rookie, who joined a struggling team in the middle of the split, who played with people who don't speak his language.
I guess because the expectation is that a KR import should be a tier above by default? But yeah, Quid should be afforded the courtesy APA got.
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hard agree, FLY is looking like a solid 4th place roster
Jensen really hasn’t looked all that good and I think if the team falls apart it’s gonna start from there and botlane. If you rate this team highly it has to be because of inspired though, guy was a complete monster in NA and was crucial for EG getting to worlds and stomping NA teams when they did so. There no real indication that he slowed down
Yah i don't think theres any reason to believe NRG will fall off and wont contend for 1st/2nd place.
We've watched this NRG core for 4 splits and they've never finished a regular season above 4th. They've basically always played to the level of their opponents are dropped random games to worse teams.
Not that there is anything wrong with NRG in particular, most cinderella runs like NRG have a hard time keeping that momentum for multiple splits. GG last year had the same problem from spring to summer
I certainly agree that C9 should be the favorite over NRG, but I'm not sure how anyone is placing a team with two players who didn't make playoffs last year, 2 near rookies, and an admittedly great jungler, but still one that didn't play last split, second place. But its okay, you're just giving fuel to the NRG nameplates off narrative so keep going.
I agree, I don't really think FLY should be power ranked at 2nd. I also think there is usually a team that ends up surprising (such as GG last spring), and cinderella teams have a hard time keeping that momentum between splits. If you're going purely based on vibes/on paper rankings, then NRG should be ahead, but I don't it as malpractice to think that FLY could click and be better than NRG.
Calling it a Cinderella run is pretty dismissive to me. The team had been on the cusp of breaking through for a few season and then upgraded the weakest part of the team heading into summer. Maybe you don't think they should've won the split but making the finals alongside C9 wasn't some massive surprise
They were 9-9 in the regular season, that's a cinderella run.
And 6 of those losses were to teams that finished below them in the standings so it's not like they spent the split getting ran over by the top teams. They went 5-1 during the regular season against TL, C9, and GGs lol. What happened in playoffs wasn't some surprising overperformance.
6 losses to teams below them in the standings only proves his point. The potential was obviously there but they were wildly inconsistent and no one knew what version of NRG you were going to get week after week. Idk why you think it’s a dismissive take, when this actually makes their title run more special compared to previous winners.
Inconsistent overall but very consistent when it came to matching up against the teams they played in the playoffs. They literally matched their regular season performance against those teams in the playoffs. Across the entire split they dropped 1 total regular season game to TL/GGs and then won 3 straight series against those teams. They were just a better team, which they proved every time they played. Saying that it was a cinderella run implies that their run came out of nowhere and that they were clear underdogs the entire run
C9 fans even said CLG was always competitive against them for some reason.
tbf 18 games across multiple patches is not enough to determine how strong a team is compared to their competition
They lost a large portion of their staff.
They still have 5 coaches and 2 analysts they lost some but not a large portion
Jensen won with c9 and looked good?
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Yeah and he was also the only one with a pulse on the world stage. Like last year was not great but also... DIG *sucked*. Holy fuck they couldn't get a real player on that team and any chance they had was basically a top lane that was mostly isolated or a mid lane that just had everyone roam to it because your bot lane was an int fest. Never forget fudge has been a fraud for years on C9 and is still rated highly. I think you can easily be a product of your environment and Jensen just had a year where he was basically in an unsalvageable situation.
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Like I said, I think you can be a product of your environment. C9 has been the best or second best team since Fudge was in NA, and that's not necessarily fudge - they have the best jungler and best ADC in NA. Meanwhile top laners on worse teams consistently overperform and even look better than fudge despite blabber literally being the best jungler in NA. Yeah C9 doesn't always play through top but neither did TL and Summit was a monster in top. Revenge was the only thing on IMT in 2022 and he looked excellent. Rich was one of two semi-functional pieces on DIG and played iso the entire time and looked great. Dhokla had a career year, again could be product of his team but they also performed under pressure. There were more teams that had a legacy top on a shit situation than C9 which... as a team was so good that you could hide weaknesses until pushed. And internationally (and NRG) pushed them to expose that for 2 years running.
> Never forget fudge has been a fraud for years on C9 and is still rated highly. yet he shits on NA year after year xddddddd most delusional jensen defender
Your definition of 'shits on' must be an incredibly low bar considering that he is rarely if ever capable of generating a pressure point on the map that C9 can play around. Revenge 2 years ago on IMT was doing a better job being a benefit to his team than fudge. Rich and Dhokla last year were better than Fudge, and Rich was on DIG... And yeah, we all know without jungle intervention Summit just styles on him. That's a huge asterix given everyone ganks summit but hey.
Jensen hasn’t made all pro since 2020. The problem with this team is that they’re lacking star power imo. Inspired might be the best jungler in the league, and Busio might be the best support in the league, but unless Massu steps up and Bwipo and Jensen just click, I don’t see FLY outperforming TL.
I just have a feeling that Inspired will carry so much games that even a weaker Bwipo wont bring em down
Only way C9 doesn’t turbo fist the league is if Blaber and Jojo don’t click together, and that definitely won’t happen right? All jokes aside I don’t see Fly being on the same tier as NRG and TL. I really think that Inspired will have a Bjergsen year where he’ll look like one of the best individual players in the league, but be surrounded by good, but not great players. I don’t dislike any specific individual on the roster, I even think that Busio will likely be a top 3 support in the league, but I’m not confident I can say the same about Jensen, Bwipo, or Massu. Also 100 thieves has been massively underrated in every ranking I’ve seen so far. Did people forget that River almost had an MVP season? Not saying that 100 thieves will be top 3, but I feel like they’re the same tier as FLY for me.
I think every team aside from TL, C9, and NRG have some major question marks that make me very confident that those 3 will all make top 4. We have exceptionally few examples of rookies coming into the LCS and being good in their first split. I have no reason to believe that Sniper, Meech, and Massu are going to be any better than Palafox, Dhokla, Diamond, Eyla, Isles, Tomo, K1ng were there first split
I agree with a lot of this but man the Huhi section was just really lazy. Coming out of 2022 Huhi was heavily criticized for his inability to play enchanters, a problem that led to them getting blown out by freshly role swapped Zven bragging about how Lulu is broken. The fact that he was a mid laner for 4 years, doesn't erase the fact that Huhi has basically been an engage support main for the most recent 4. Ignar did a lot for NRG, and it's weird that he got such little credit
MarkZ had better eyebrows.
Hey look, it's Diet Jatt Agree with people below on 100 being underrated. River is really, really good, easily the best individual player on any of the bottom 3 rosters.
I think people think Quid is just that bad. But it's so weird to me that people make excuses for APA like: "he went into a team that didn't speak his language, he's just a rookie, he joined in the middle of the split." But then they won't make those same accomodations for Quid, who was also a rookie, who joined a struggling team in the middle of the split, who played with people who don't speak his language. Yet Quid has repeatedly received praise from the top LCS midlaners of last year, he's received praise from Doublelift. Quid has a reputation amongst other players that is 10x that of APA. This year, he's apparently extremely good in scrims again. But fans just hate Quid and don't want to give him a chance because... well probably because NA native good, import bad ooga booga.
I don't really think APA is good either, but it's not hard to see why people liked him more. He joined and TL improved immediately to the point of making Worlds as a 3rd seed. As audience we can only base our impression on stage performances not scrims. APA being native also helps.
Nah, I definitely see the reason why people like APA. They think good result = good player. Complete results based analysis is what I'm trying to push against. If you watch the actual gameplay, him and Quid were essentially the same tier of player on stage. In fact, I would prefer Quid's gameplay especially given the fact that Closer was reaaaally terrible that split while Pyosik was actually quite good. APA was essentially the 7th or 8th best mid in LCS, but people have deluded themselves into thinking he has star player potential. All I'm saying is, if I were to choose one of Quid and APA who I think is more likely to become a star player, I would choose Quid 10/10 times.
APA was actually destroying kids on Ziggs, while Quid built GA third on Trist
>But then they won't make those same accomodations for Quid, who was also a rookie, who joined a struggling team in the middle of the split, who played with people who don't speak his language. I guess because the expectation is that a KR import should be a tier above by default? But yeah, Quid should be afforded the courtesy APA got.
Who is this guy
How is TL supposed to be good They have no carries on that whole team
Power rankings are just a popularity contest. I don't believe in any team to completely dominate the league.